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Apple & HTML5

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Re: Apple & HTML5

#21

Post by thought_alarm »

shadowsun7 wrote: post #13

+1 for Apple educating people on the awesomeness of HTML5. -1 for being Safari-only. Then again, when you think about it - the Safari-only filter implicitly tells people that Safari is the 'only' browser (or the best browser) currently supporting HTML5; that other browsers have to play catchup.

They explicitly say this on the front page: "Not all browsers offer this support. But soon other modern browsers will take advantage of these same web standards — and the amazing things they enable web designers to do"

Re: Apple & HTML5

#22

Post by tmsh »

shadowsun7 wrote: post #19

Source code and developer documentation for the demos found here: http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/

Yeah, most work in Chrome (on Linux).

Edit: that said, imho, the original link is somewhat misguided. It brings up an interesting question: is Apple responsible for targeting all platforms, or at least all major platforms that conform to a standard? Even if those standards aren't fully implemented among different browsers? And wtf, Apple, I wanna play checkers... Some of the demos run really well on Linux though. But I mean -- are they responsible for all platforms? Or maybe they're just responsible for not misleading people into thinking that they must choose their platform? (The issues in Microsoft's antitrust history rise again.)

Anyway, for my money I don't think the future of the web is via the traditional browser -- but I'm sort of in left field in this regard. But yeah, there are maybe deeper issues that haven't really been resolved...

Re: Apple & HTML5

#23

Post by noibl »

tumult wrote: post #15
bradgessler wrote: post #3

Neat idea, very poor implementation. If you try to view the examples in Google Chrome, you'll get a notice that you have to download Safari ( http://skitch.com/bradgessler/dgw7p/apple-html5 ) This sets a very poor example for Apple supporting standards.

Some of the demos only work in Safari. Even a nightly Chromium snapshot does not support everything that Safari does. I ran Chromium with my user agent set to Safari. And here's where it gets interesting. The demos that don't work in Chromium, notably the ones that require CSS 3D transforms, get removed from the listings on the pages that have them. So for example, the "Transitions" page, only the Dissolve, Toss, Sli…

> Some of the demos only work in Safari

Which, given other browser-makers' commitment to supporting the emerging specs, just goes to show that 'standards' is a misnomer in this case. In informal usage that's OK; most of us hope that the standardisation of CSS3, HTML5 and related WHATWG initiatives will happen sooner rather than later. But misapplying the term in your marketing material (linked from the front page) is confusing and unhelpful.

Re: Apple & HTML5

#24

Post by alanstorm »

Does anyone know what word we're supposed to use for "Web Development techniques that help ensure a consistency of experience across browsers for all users regardless of browser choice" now that "standards" means something else?

Re: Apple & HTML5

#25

Post by bradgessler »

billpaetzke wrote: post #7
bradgessler wrote: post #3

Neat idea, very poor implementation. If you try to view the examples in Google Chrome, you'll get a notice that you have to download Safari ( http://skitch.com/bradgessler/dgw7p/apple-html5 ) This sets a very poor example for Apple supporting standards.

* Apple might be nudging people to use Safari as their main browser. * Apple might have limited to Safari to keep things simple--to be absolutely sure their demo would work 100%. * I agree that it sucks that their demos are only viewable w/ Safari. But there are plenty of HTML5 demos out there for us :)

Its not that it sucks, its that Apple is being misleading about HTML5.

Re: Apple & HTML5

#26

Post by papachito »

thought_alarm wrote: post #21
shadowsun7 wrote: post #13

+1 for Apple educating people on the awesomeness of HTML5. -1 for being Safari-only. Then again, when you think about it - the Safari-only filter implicitly tells people that Safari is the 'only' browser (or the best browser) currently supporting HTML5; that other browsers have to play catchup.

They explicitly say this on the front page: "Not all browsers offer this support. But soon other modern browsers will take advantage of these same web standards — and the amazing things they enable web designers to do"

The problem is that they block Chrome 5 too, which is more advanced than Safari 4 (newer version of webkit).

Re: Apple & HTML5

#27

Post by ellyagg »

bradgessler wrote: post #3

Neat idea, very poor implementation. If you try to view the examples in Google Chrome, you'll get a notice that you have to download Safari ( http://skitch.com/bradgessler/dgw7p/apple-html5 ) This sets a very poor example for Apple supporting standards.

> This sets a very poor example for Apple supporting standards.

Can you, or any of the dozens of upvoters, explain the logic behind that criticism? It literally seems to make no sense to me, so I must be missing something. The page talks about emerging web standards and talks about Safari and Apple's support for them. It mentions that not all browsers support all of the latest standards, and then it gives examples of some of the latest standards that Safari supports. So, huh?

Re: Apple & HTML5

#28

Post by ellyagg »

noibl wrote: post #23
tumult wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of the demos only work in Safari. Even a nightly Chromium snapshot does not support everything that Safari does. I ran Chromium with my user agent set to Safari. And here's where it gets interesting. The demos that don't work in Chromium, notably the ones that require CSS 3D transforms, get removed from the listings on the pages that have them. So for example, the "Transitions" page, only the Dissolve, Toss, Sli…

> Some of the demos only work in Safari Which, given other browser-makers' commitment to supporting the emerging specs, just goes to show that 'standards' is a misnomer in this case. In informal usage that's OK; most of us hope that the standardisation of CSS3, HTML5 and related WHATWG initiatives will happen sooner rather than later. But misapplying the term in your marketing material (linked from the front page) is…

Uh, what? The vast majority of the time, when people talk about web standards, they mean the W3C recommendations. Suddenly, when Apple uses it in marketing material, it means "recommendations that have been implemented by all browsers"?

Re: Apple & HTML5

#29

Post by jsz0 »

ube wrote: post #10
[deleted] wrote: post #4

[deleted]

Since both chrome and safari use webkit to render - chrome should work too shouldn't it? Granted - Apple's definition of open is "you should only use Apple products".

Nope. Google uses a ton of WebKit code, submits a lot of code back into WebKit proper, but they're doing their own stuff too. IIRC they wanted to have GPU acceleration for 3D CSS which apparently WebKit proper doesn't offer at this point or Google thinks they can do it better. You can't safely assume all WebKit based browsers are going to be equal.

Re: Apple & HTML5

#30

Post by noibl »

ellyagg wrote: post #28
noibl wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some of the demos only work in Safari Which, given other browser-makers' commitment to supporting the emerging specs, just goes to show that 'standards' is a misnomer in this case. In informal usage that's OK; most of us hope that the standardisation of CSS3, HTML5 and related WHATWG initiatives will happen sooner rather than later. But misapplying the term in your marketing material (linked from the front page) is…

Uh, what? The vast majority of the time, when people talk about web standards, they mean the W3C recommendations. Suddenly, when Apple uses it in marketing material, it means "recommendations that have been implemented by all browsers"?

Compare:

http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/ 'W3C Working Draft 4 March 2010'

http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/ 'W3C Recommendation 24 December 1999'

So by 'recommendation', am I to assume you're talking about HTML 4.01?

(edit: again with the downvotes, no answer...)

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