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Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

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Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#111

Post by seanmcdirmid »

oculusthrift wrote: post #79
crabasa wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Over the last five years, Ford has posted net income totaling $26 billion, while Tesla has lost $2.3 billion. Ford: "We have no idea how to invest this money. I guess let's just put it in the bank." Tesla: "We have so many idea for investments, we're only constrained by cash. Let's go back to the capital markets!"

except ford is spending an order of magnitude more than tesla. it's much easier to spend 100 dollars meaningfully than a 100 billion. I also hope you're willing to level the same charge at Google and Apple.

It is like comparing a spunky startup to an entrenched corporation. Ya, IBM once spent more than Facebook, but Facebook was worth more because it had potential while IBM didn't.

Ford doesn't have any good ideas for the future, they are too busy with the here and now and haven't shown an ability to do anything but incremental improvements with their R&D spending. Like we don't expect much more from IBM, we don't expect much more from Ford, but we do from Tesla.

Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#112

Post by sillysaurus3 »

Alupis wrote: post #99
dsugarman wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla is potentially a trillion dollar company and it's biggest current hurdle is getting it's production up to meet an enormous demand. The reason it's trading at a higher market cap is because Ford doesn't have any growth potential and Tesla is still trading at a fraction of what it could be. Of course there is still a ton of risk factors for them, but expected value for investing should be based on the chance of s…

> Tesla is potentially a trillion dollar company A trillion dollars? For a niche/luxury car company? What fantasy is that based on? > it's biggest current hurdle is getting it's production up to meet an enormous demand While enormous to Tesla, actual demand is pretty small compared to other car companies. It doesn't help that even the most "affordable" Tesla is far more expensive than the average competitor's EV or h…

If batteries reduce the demand for oil, oil's value will start to transfer to batteries.

Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#113

Post by John23832 »

sergiosgc wrote: post #104
pc86 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because Tesla's cars are not "hugely complicated contraption[s] made up of hundreds of mechanical parts?"

To a much lesser degree. An electric engine is a lot simpler, mechanically, than an ICE. To the point that, I think, major malfunctions will result in replacement of the engine instead of fixing engine components. Given good refurbishment logistics, this is much more efficient.

I'm sorry, but that's just not true.

The basic premise of an electric "engine" is simpler than that of an ICE, but when you actually make the car, it's nowhere near as simple on paper. Just look at the issue people have had with getting Tesla's repaired... the "mechanics" don't even know that you have to keep the battery charged.

Also, don't ignore the fact that we have 100+ years of experience with ICE.

Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#115

Post by FilterSweep »

dsugarman wrote: post #55
dan1234 wrote: post #2

Interesting, but market cap isn’t everything - FTA: "While Tesla’s market capitalization has swelled in size, Ford still overshadows the Palo Alto, California-based company in most other financial metrics. Over the last five years, Ford has posted net income totaling $26 billion, while Tesla has lost $2.3 billion. Last year, Ford had annual revenue of $151.8 billion compared with Tesla’s $7 billion. And when it comes…

Tesla is potentially a trillion dollar company and it's biggest current hurdle is getting it's production up to meet an enormous demand. The reason it's trading at a higher market cap is because Ford doesn't have any growth potential and Tesla is still trading at a fraction of what it could be. Of course there is still a ton of risk factors for them, but expected value for investing should be based on the chance of s…

> Ford doesn't have any growth potential

Word? https://seekingalpha.com/article/4031938-ford-potential-grow

Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#116

Post by John23832 »

mikeash wrote: post #103
John23832 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bureaucracy goes out the window when you have an activist investor asking you why you're ignoring clear market trends.

By the time the trends become that clear, you're often years behind.

We are behind, but a competent investor isn't.

Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#118

Post by Jtsummers »

jernfrost wrote: post #65
rebootthesystem wrote: post #32

My prediction has always been that all traditional car manufacturers will jump into the market with gusto at the next inflection point in battery technology. The current state of the art battery technology for vehicles is heavy and has less than desirable energy density. The minute a new technology can deliver twice the energy density at the same or lower weight and lower cost most established car manufacturers will…

When that change comes the other players will have the problem that they too will need to build some sort of Gigafactory. There is no way they can do a rushed attack against Tesla on this. These guys are slow movers not willing to take big risks. When this battery technology switch happens I am pretty sure Tesla will actually be the first to move. They will have more experience with large scale battery production tha…

They could also buy from the gigafactory, just like Apple buys components from Samsung (their competitor within, particularly, the mobile market). Google licensed their search engine to Yahoo and others.

Tesla is not in a position to replace Ford and others, and they won't be for several years. Even then, they won't be in a position to displace anyone in anything other than consumer vehicles. They have no truck and no announcement for a truck. They have no busses. They have no heavy equipment.

Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#119

Post by ovulator »

dsugarman wrote: post #55
dan1234 wrote: post #2

Interesting, but market cap isn’t everything - FTA: "While Tesla’s market capitalization has swelled in size, Ford still overshadows the Palo Alto, California-based company in most other financial metrics. Over the last five years, Ford has posted net income totaling $26 billion, while Tesla has lost $2.3 billion. Last year, Ford had annual revenue of $151.8 billion compared with Tesla’s $7 billion. And when it comes…

Tesla is potentially a trillion dollar company and it's biggest current hurdle is getting it's production up to meet an enormous demand. The reason it's trading at a higher market cap is because Ford doesn't have any growth potential and Tesla is still trading at a fraction of what it could be. Of course there is still a ton of risk factors for them, but expected value for investing should be based on the chance of s…

What are you basing that trillion dollar evaluation off of?

Combining the 5 largest auto manufactures on earth and you are still well short of a trillion dollar company.

Re: Tesla Passes Ford by Market Value

#120

Post by agreedasdfs4 »

macspoofing wrote: post #109
dsugarman wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla is potentially a trillion dollar company and it's biggest current hurdle is getting it's production up to meet an enormous demand. The reason it's trading at a higher market cap is because Ford doesn't have any growth potential and Tesla is still trading at a fraction of what it could be. Of course there is still a ton of risk factors for them, but expected value for investing should be based on the chance of s…

>Tesla is potentially a trillion dollar company... Huh?

Tesla isn't a car company. It's a power/battery company that makes electric cars.

This is the goal:

https://www.tesla.com/tesla_theme/assets/img/solar/section-h...

Powerwall Solar roof Car

All made/sold by Tesla.

If Apple can be a multi-billion dollar company making laptops, phones, and an app store, I don't really see the Tesla "could be a trillion dollar company" as too far-fetched.

I mean this is the era when SnapChat is "worth 25 billion".

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