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Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

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Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#211

Post by bhntr3 »

allannienhuis wrote: post #206
Maakuth wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This technique is also useful for software development, and is referred to as rubber duck debugging ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_duck_debugging ). Verbalizing your problem lends you another point of view to your thinking and often allows you to discover the problem yourself.

Writing detailed commit notes can be useful in the same way. I have backed out of a commit during the write up more times than I would like to admit because I realized that I hadn't covered some edge case or I completely forgot about something (like the effect of the change on a report or other sub-system). Writing things out in a way that someone else can understand forces you to re-think through the task in differe…

People sometimes tease me for reviewing my own pull requests.

But I am a big believer in roles. The reviewer role is different than the creator role. When I mentally switch, through the priming mechanism of my code review tool, I am often able to see the defects in my own design or code.

I sometimes do the same thing with design docs or proposals by imagining myself as the person who has the most to lose by my proposal succeeding and then commenting on my doc from their perspective.

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#212

Post by tomcam »

kalleboo wrote: post #77
saulrh wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. I have a "keys-wallet-phone-pad" routine in which I make sure my pockets contain all of: my keys, my wallet, my cell phone, and the 7-inch tablet that I carry everywhere. I've gotten into the habit of doing it every time I get up if I'm not at home or at my desk at work.

I used to have a doormat that said "mobile phone, keys, wallet" (in Swedish) https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/7f/58/df/7f58... These days I just tap my pockets. I freak out if I do that check when I happen to be holding onto my phone or keys

I use this technique too. Very, very effective. Unfortunately I often cary a pocket radio, which I unconsciously note as either wallet or phone. Have started to use its clip to attach it to my shirt.

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#213

Post by 7952 »

ianamartin wrote: post #93
jakub_g wrote: post #32

I noticed the problem on myself on several occasions and kind of invented the same solution. For example, sometimes I would take a medicament mechanically while doing something else and just a few minutes later, forget if I took it or not. Solution: say loud to myself "I'm taking a pill". Another: sometimes I'd lend some amount money to a colleague, and a few weeks later I'd have a hard time figuring whether they gav…

Ah, yes. The old upside-down-tomato-sauce-can-next-to-the-door-to-remember-my-umbrella trick. That's always been a classic. The first couple of times I tried it, it didn't work very well. I was trying to leave in the morning, and I tripped over the can, and I was all, "Who the fuck put a can of tomatoes in front of the door?" And I kicked it out of the way and left without my umbrella. Then I realized I wasn't going…

Why not just put the actual umbrella against the door.

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#214

Post by bleair »

Maakuth wrote: post #154
prashnts wrote: post #117

Slightly off topic but this practice of talking-out-loud to get yourself doing stuff is also beneficial to people with executive dysfunction. If your executive function is impaired you generally don't have the "internal monologue" or the voice in your head. This makes seemingly simpler things like taking a shower, driving, or eating, very difficult! I'd often "forget" to eat, simply because I could not get myself to…

This technique is also useful for software development, and is referred to as rubber duck debugging ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_duck_debugging ). Verbalizing your problem lends you another point of view to your thinking and often allows you to discover the problem yourself.

I'm certain the value here comes from changing your focus and mindset. If you switch to a mode of thinking of "I ned to give you (the rubber ducky) context and explain concepts so that you can see intention and reasons for this code chage/ bug behavior". This change of mindset allows you to view and reason about things better.

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#215

Post by princeb »

princeb wrote: post #167

people talk to themselves all the time on the trading floor (the kanko part of the shinsakanko). rather look like a weirdo than lose a couple thousand bucks (or worse) on a 100% avoidable error.

edit: to clarify, when submitting orders to an electronic exchange, traders will call out (to themselves) the price size direction and instrument before sending the ticket. I personally also mouseover all the important parts so i'm not just going through motions.

this method seems particularly effective for work that is routine but never in the same scenario. Ever since I picked up this habit I have applied this to everything else I do - booking flight tickets, hotels, buying things on amazon, etc. avoiding errors is so much of a good thing - for those of you with really bad experiences firefighting at work will know the importance of not being in the position where you need to firefight at all.

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#216

Post by always_good »

bradknowles wrote: post #195
jonahx wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would take a medicament mechanically This is not intended obnoxiously, but I assume English is not your first language (though your English is good) and you'd want to know: "medicament" is an incredibly uncommon way to refer to "medication." In fact, the majority of native English speakers would not recognize it.

With respect, you figured out what he meant, and then you figured out that he's not a native English speaker. He probably doesn't need to have that fact pointed out to him. I'm sure there's a better way you could have given the hint to the correct word for the benefit of others who didn't figure out what he meant, and done so without being condescending to the post you were replying to. Yes?

Honestly, one thing I like about HN is that these sorts of corrections are made, and made respectfully.

Their post was interesting because they're right: I'm a native English speaker and I paused on "medicament".

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#217

Post by jakub_g »

bradknowles wrote: post #195
jonahx wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would take a medicament mechanically This is not intended obnoxiously, but I assume English is not your first language (though your English is good) and you'd want to know: "medicament" is an incredibly uncommon way to refer to "medication." In fact, the majority of native English speakers would not recognize it.

With respect, you figured out what he meant, and then you figured out that he's not a native English speaker. He probably doesn't need to have that fact pointed out to him. I'm sure there's a better way you could have given the hint to the correct word for the benefit of others who didn't figure out what he meant, and done so without being condescending to the post you were replying to. Yes?

OP here, no issue, thanks for pointing it out; I even appreciate it, I'm a bit of a grammar nazi myself - but yeah people vary. I think it's ok to post that kind of comments on HN, outside of HN probably less.

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#218

Post by jakub_g »

7952 wrote: post #213
ianamartin wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, yes. The old upside-down-tomato-sauce-can-next-to-the-door-to-remember-my-umbrella trick. That's always been a classic. The first couple of times I tried it, it didn't work very well. I was trying to leave in the morning, and I tripped over the can, and I was all, "Who the fuck put a can of tomatoes in front of the door?" And I kicked it out of the way and left without my umbrella. Then I realized I wasn't going…

Why not just put the actual umbrella against the door.

The umbrella is just one of potential examples of $thing_to_do. But for me putting umbrella next to the door didn't really work. I'd have to put it on the floor for it to work, and I don't like putting things on the floor - though it's another highly effective solution :)

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#219

Post by bhntr3 »

jakub_g wrote: post #32

I noticed the problem on myself on several occasions and kind of invented the same solution. For example, sometimes I would take a medicament mechanically while doing something else and just a few minutes later, forget if I took it or not. Solution: say loud to myself "I'm taking a pill". Another: sometimes I'd lend some amount money to a colleague, and a few weeks later I'd have a hard time figuring whether they gav…

You're getting teased a bit but I think this is a very smart thing to do.

The automatic processes of our brain dominate the majority of our behavior. If you're a deep thinker who often ties up his attentive thread thinking through a tough technical problem or something, you need to prime your automatic process with some surprise that triggers the association.

I think Kahneman's Thinking Fast and Slow does a good job explaining this. But I also like the idea of the "elephant and the rider" from Jonathan Haidt. This quora post (https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-rider-and-the-elephant-met...) gives a nice summary but I highly recommend his book.

Bringing it back to TFA, I think the Japanese as a culture might have a better relationship to the frailty of human rationality. The enlightenment was a great period in Western history but it cemented a belief in the power of reason and the universality of truth.

The Japanese have a longer history of training the mind through repeated action, visualization and behavior. Western cultures just want to power through it with rationality. So, we don't point at stuff repetitively and repeat things out loud to ourselves even if it would save lives. Kind of a bummer.

I dig your upside down tomato can, man.

Re: Why Japan’s Rail Workers Point at Things

#220

Post by rabboRubble »

jakub_g wrote: post #32

I noticed the problem on myself on several occasions and kind of invented the same solution. For example, sometimes I would take a medicament mechanically while doing something else and just a few minutes later, forget if I took it or not. Solution: say loud to myself "I'm taking a pill". Another: sometimes I'd lend some amount money to a colleague, and a few weeks later I'd have a hard time figuring whether they gav…

Level 23 trick... instead of leaving your umbrella next to the door, leave your house/car keys with your umbrella.
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