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Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

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Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#51
post #32
post #29

In my case when I've regretted it was much because the "attitude problem". For a team of 10 devs (I've recruited all of them), I remember two specifically cases in which I regretted to hire those guys. Guy #1: A "developer" who was trash talking everyone (even me) and then he pretended he didn't do it or he alleged "I didn't say that", he complained about every one of his teammates, he pretended and believes that he…

Serious question--for some reason, I've always believed that previous employers tend to avoid saying anything negative about their former employees. Is this not the case?

They don't usually trash former employees, but you can read between the line.

One time a reference given by the candidate for a senior post glossed over everything but focused on attendance. "He is a good guy. He is always on time for work and very punctual for meetings."

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#52
post #13

If you hire enough people, eventually you'll have a bunch of examples for this question, unless of course you never make mistakes. Pretty much everything you can imagine can go wrong and probably more. Hiring anyone is always a risk but it's one you can't avoid, nor do I think that the interview process should be so tough as to have lots of false negatives to prevent those bad hires; better IMO to have a reasonable f…

> Developers who fail to check their own work, or do it so hastily they don't notice glaring mistakes, or who are rushing so much they don't / can't follow a simple spec.

You would actually fire somebody for being unable to keep up with a deadline they didn't set? In my experience, this is mostly the result of management placing too strict a deadline on too junior a dev. It's a mentoring moment, not a firing one.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#53
post #13

If you hire enough people, eventually you'll have a bunch of examples for this question, unless of course you never make mistakes. Pretty much everything you can imagine can go wrong and probably more. Hiring anyone is always a risk but it's one you can't avoid, nor do I think that the interview process should be so tough as to have lots of false negatives to prevent those bad hires; better IMO to have a reasonable f…

Don't you think the first one can be a result of imposter syndrome and not wanting to risk looking like a fool for asking for help?

If they feel like they ought to be able to figure it out on their own, asking for help suddenly is a big hurdle because they think that their colleagues will judge them for it.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#54

I've never had a hire go wrong for technical reasons. I have hired, participated in hiring, or inherited several developers who had to be let go for reasons related to attitude or soft skills. Some examples: - a guy with an alcohol problem who would disappear for a week at a time or come in to work sloshed - a junior developer who had major problems with authority, mixed with bizarre paranoia. He refused to take dire…

That's one reason we rely heavily on thorough, structured reference checks.

It's definitely fair to check this. Also I think this works very well when the hire worked in a well-ordered place beforehands. On the contrary, if someone worked at a toxic work place before - it's probably counterproductive to ask colleagues or even managers. Odds are high the person is exactly leaving because of that.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#55

I've regretted hiring a few developers who have been apathetic about the actual software product we're making. I am sometimes too optimistic about a technically proficient candidate sharing these traits, during the interview process. After hiring they are depressingly unexcited about delivering a new feature that promises business value, significantly improves performance etc. It's just work to be done.

If a few developers have been apathetic maybe it's that your product/tech is not exciting enough for them?

I know quite a few devs that would be like that if they had to work on something like a legacy J2EE webapp.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#56
post #34
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question--for some reason, I've always believed that previous employers tend to avoid saying anything negative about their former employees. Is this not the case?

This is very much the case. When employees/employers broadcast negative info about each other, both parties suffer. Obviously, the accused suffers because all this negative info about them is now public, but the accuser also suffers because they look like a jerk for publishing it. Who would want to work with a person/company that is known to talk crap about people they work with? I think angvp is only publishing this…

    > but the accuser also suffers because they look 
    > like a jerk for publishing it
Or the accused now goes "well, I wasn't going to say anything, but here are all the things I didn't like about you."

Somewhat related, but this is one of the reasons for 5-star inflation in feedback systems like Airbnb.

I recently saw this exchange in a review:

Host: The guest kept the windows open with the A/C on full blast the whole time.

Guest: lol, you were spying on me? I wasn't going to say anything, but your place smelled like human feces.

Looks pretty bad for both parties and not something you want in your history, so my experience with Airbnb is that people give good ratings except for the worst of conditions. I think as far as Airbnb cares, it's working as intended. Everything looks peachy.

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#57
This is an interesting question, because it signals that you are most likely very new to hiring, and maybe ill-equipped to handle managing people in general. Although, at least you're asking questions.

First, very rarely does a manager regret a hire even though it's very common for a hire not to work out. Hiring and interviewing are in terrible shape right now, and more often then not lead to terrible hiring/job acceptance choices.

Second, you regret hiring PEOPLE, not developers because regrettable hires aren't specific to developers. When they are, it's because an engineer was given too much access to something they should not have been and a theft/breach occurs.

Examples of these concepts in play: The NSA probably regrets hiring Edward Snowden. I don't regret hiring the last JS dev I hired even though it didn't work out and he moved to a different company.

Lack of technical expertise is a problem sometimes, but it can be nurtured. Lack of personal skills is a huge problem in an office environment, and is much, much harder to nurture. But neither of these are regrettable in-and-of themselves.

The thing to remember is that you have to weigh the urgency of hiring against the long term impacts of hiring the wrong person. In other words, be careful and set up controls, but don't allow decision paralysis.

Good luck with your project, keep your head up, and expect failure. Great employees are rare, so just keep at it.

post mobile edit:

Go read:

Good To Great: https://www.amazon.com/Good-Great-Some-Companies-Others/dp/0...

How to Win Friends and Influence People: https://www.amazon.com/How-win-friends-influence-people-eboo...

Emotional Intelligence: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JMKVCG/

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#58
If you're having problems with finding technology workers, consider the idea that you're not a tech company. You build human traps. That's why you are getting the talent you are getting. You don't need programmers. You need digital plumbers.

TRIGGER WARNING: This guy is a super big evil meanie who needs rainbows and huggie hugs..... but he's not wrong when it comes to who you attract and why you attract them: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0Y4uzaf2HA

Re: Ask HN: Have you ever regretted hiring a developer?

#60
post #30

In interview what appeared to be a potential-hire's strength - became a real nuisance when we hired him. We wanted someone who could do both android and iOS. He was a senior, had enough to showcase and plenty to 'talk about software architectural things'. It turned out, he was jack of all trades (python, java, objective-c) but he really-really struggled at designing software but he could talk through people and walls…

Sadly, in some places, it's not what you know, but who you can bullshit.

Why didn't you guys fire him? Why did you just let him stagnate until he quit?

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