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Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

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Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#111

I've only recently started reading about deep neural networks, and the thing that strikes me the most about the literature is the lack of mathematics . Open a NIPS paper from 2010 or so, and you'll see extremely dense mathematics: nonparametrics, variational approximation, sampling theory, riemannian geometry. But from my (admittedly small) sampling of the convnet / RNN literature there really doesn't seem to be much…

> I'm not sure whether there's anything to learn from this observation

I think it is our duty to explore all the possibilities of neural networks. They are still not fully understood yet. Theory will catch up once we practically understand the beast. It might not be pure math, but it is a necessary exploration nonetheless.

Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#112
post #75
post #70

Why is it that Neural Net-based ML only seems to be claiming results with images and natural language? Maybe I'm out of the loop, but I haven't seen anything demonstrating results on "data" – the kinds of challenges that are actually valuable to businesses. Why is that? Are those just less sexy / more proprietary in nature, or is there something about those challenges that make NN's less useful to them?

First of, there is. These NN are good at exploiting the 'spatiality prior' in some types of data, like text and images. It means that features in the data which are close together, should be combined when you climb in the hierarchy of features. Databases with columns and rows don't have that prior for instance. Second, there is also the peer reviewing problem. You are still trying to explain a very abstract concept t…

Only the first reason is correct (NNs are good at data with dimensional relationships).

The second reason is pretty bogus (text/images more graspable). It's valid if you're talking about mass media / popular press. But for research papers 1) images / large snippets of text are actually a negative since images take a lot of space and 2) the people doing peer review are expert scientists. They know the benchmarks and the theory.

Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#113
post #69
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, no one seems to be able to run it.

Would appreciate a link showing this.

Believe you'll find supporting comments on the original HN thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13958366

Matlab seems to need a commercial license for at least one barrier.

Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#114

This is really incredible. Maybe a neat idea: artist draws/paints frames for animation, frames are converted into semi-photorealistic images through this software, and assembled into a movie.

I expect this is going to be the future of animation, since drawing in-between frames and backgrounds is very labor-intensive and expensive.

It'll be interesting to watch how copyright law treats training data. Suppose I want to make an animation in the style of Disney or Studio Ghibli or Kyoto Animation, and so I use their entire body of work as training data to generate output in the same style from my own sketches. Is that now a derivative work? Is it different when a human copies a style while drawing by hand (requiring a degree of effort and skill that few possess) versus if a computer does most of the work (requiring low effort and ordinary artistic skills)? Would animation be treated any differently than, say, training an AI to write songs like Bob Dylan or write stories like J.R.R. Tolkien or host a radio show like Garrison Keillor?

Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#115
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This will hurt journalists reporting on facts more than it will hurt targets of smear campaigns. Journalist: "Here is a compromising photo of a politician." Politician: "Here are 1M photos of every politician doing every imaginable illegal act. Prove that your one photo is not similarly fabricated."

Good journalism is typically not dependent on "gotcha" images. It might hurt amateur twitter reporting, though.

What?!

Iconic photos are crucial for telling news in a way people remember. For example:

* We remember Tienemen square because of [tank man](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tank_Man)

* We remember napalm in Vietnam because of [Phan Thi Kim Phuc](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tank_Man)

* There are too many pictures from the civil rights movement, so I'll [just link to the Getty's gallery](http://www.gettyimages.com/event/the-american-souths-troubli...). These pictures tell the story of violence against black far better than any article ever could.

Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#117

Really impressive stuff. Could this same technique be used on human photos to transfer traits like gender, age, ethnicity? Could be really useful for those age-progressed photos used in missing persons listings, for instance.

Is someone also thinking of CRUD on clothing on humans?

Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#118

I've only recently started reading about deep neural networks, and the thing that strikes me the most about the literature is the lack of mathematics . Open a NIPS paper from 2010 or so, and you'll see extremely dense mathematics: nonparametrics, variational approximation, sampling theory, riemannian geometry. But from my (admittedly small) sampling of the convnet / RNN literature there really doesn't seem to be much…

A friend of mine from academia was considering going into industry, so went to some data science meetups. Someone was giving a presentation about convolutional networks, yet did not know what a convolution was. At first I was startled, but in the long run machine learning applications will be decided just as much on user experience and design features as on algorithmic choices.

I'm not a web programmer, but I imagine few developers could remember the mathematics[0] of the sorting algorithms that are fundamental underpinnings of their work (if they ever learned them at all). Yet I'm not sure it matters, even to great developers. The same thing will probably ultimately be true of machine learning. Honestly, you need not know what a convolution is to build a perfectly usable convnet. (And ultimately you may not need to even build your own if you can use a nifty amazon API.)

Whether NIPS should care or not is a separate story. It seems a little sad - I took all this hard pure math as an undergrad, and it doesn't seem to be important if all I'm doing is changing a few layer parameters (even if the change is ingenious).

[0] mathematics as in proof of sorting, proof of bounds on space/time complexity, etc.

Re: Unpaired Image-to-Image Translation using Cycle-Consistent Adversarial Networks

#119
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what we're seeing is these fields pre-deep learning were mathematical disciplines making steady progress on well-understood foundations. Then deep learning came in, was exceptionally effective at problems that had been difficult to crack, and people shifted focus because it seems weird to be diddling around with incremental gains on techniques that are significantly less effective. What this created though, was a…

Also, deep net problems are different than traditional CS because we can mathematically define when say a list of numbers is sorted but not when "this image looks photorealistic". Effectively, deep nets are good at tricking human visual cortex, so I'm not sure theres a deeper mathematical reason they work well, in the same way that the reason mp3 compression works so well is that they tested it against human hearing.…

> in the same way that the reason mp3 compression works so well

But there are deeper reasons that mp3 works well, besides "tested against humans". It's just that those reasons are about psychoacoustics. The most obvious example is that humans are bad at discerning amplitude and phase differences at high frequencies.

I expect that as we get deeper into the theory around why particular algorithms work, we'll find similar answers. We'll be able to say things like "when an image has the following statistical properties, we're likely to interpret it as a cat". Of course, right now we can trivially say that if by "the following statistical properties" we mean "activates this specifically trained network in a particular way", but the point is that we can probably boil that down into deeper (and simpler) statements about how human image recognition works.

I can't find a link about it now, but I remember reading that for their Translate app, Google created a way to lossily compress their character recognition neural net. That kind of research seems likely to me to lead to a better understanding of how to boil down the insights that these learning algorithms are gleaning.

This Two Minute Papers video has some thinking along the same lines: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBWTD2aNb_o

But I'd also point out that the human visual cortex is itself a bunch of models about the real world. It's gotten that way through a combination of evolution and learning. When engineers train neural networks to do tricks like TFA shows, those networks are effectively modeling the real world in two different ways: directly, and by proxy in modeling human visual systems. So the insights we can find by studying them are likely to tell us not only about our own vision, but about the world itself.

Finally, it's worth noting that graphics algorithms have always been about human visual systems and the real physical world, as opposed to deep mathematical truths. Look at this paper for example: http://www.jiansun.org/papers/Dehaze_CVPR2009.pdf

The oversimplified plain English insight those researchers had is "For a photo that doesn't contain haze, you usually can find a fully saturated pixel within some reasonably small neighborhood of any point in the image." There's no deep mathematical insight there, but there is an important insight into the statistical nature of natural images – a fact about the physical world. And they use that insight to great effect: they can remove haze from photographs, and even use the haze as a way of estimating a depth map.

So sure, while you're right that there probably aren't many deep mathematical insights to find from the results of deep learning algorithms (which is generally true of graphics algorithms anyway), I wouldn't gloss over the deep practical insights that they encode.

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