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When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

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Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#41
post #5

As a shareholder, hopefully never. Building infrastructure and platforms has three wonderful benefits: * Good customers, where good is defined as smart and willing to spend money. Going up the stack means dealing making sacrifices on both of those dimensions. * Less complex products that stay relevant longer. Amazon builds legos and leaves the task of putting them together to others. The assembly can create value, bu…

i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model. 1. good customers - infrastructure customers are not good customers. they are fickle and extremely price sensitive, which is tough to do on a super capital intensive business like hosting, even on amazon cloud's insanely high cost. 2. less complex products - i don't understand how there is there anything about amazon's cloud…

> they are fickle and extremely price sensitive

Not at all. Most customers couldn't care less about money.

There are numerous people who are price sensitive, the amateurs who are running a test app and complaining that digital ocean is cheaper, then move to the weirdest hoster they could find because that's only $2 a month. These are NOT AWS customers.

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#42
post #5

As a shareholder, hopefully never. Building infrastructure and platforms has three wonderful benefits: * Good customers, where good is defined as smart and willing to spend money. Going up the stack means dealing making sacrifices on both of those dimensions. * Less complex products that stay relevant longer. Amazon builds legos and leaves the task of putting them together to others. The assembly can create value, bu…

Google App Engine is a product, not just a collection of APIs or even an application. The closest thing Amazon has to that is Elastic Beanstalk, which resembles Heroku closely.

If Beanstalk could compete with Heroku, no one would use Heroku.

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#43
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google App Engine is a product, not just a collection of APIs or even an application. The closest thing Amazon has to that is Elastic Beanstalk, which resembles Heroku closely.

It's a pretty shallow clone of even Heroku.

And Heroku is a thin layer on AWS. :)

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#44

AWS created its partner network exactly for this. They just supply their technology and consulting partners with building blocks so they can do the tailoring. The author apparently didn't do proper due diligence before typing down this article.

Amazon retail has a reputation for allowing marketplace sellers onto their site then cloning things that sell well [1]. If they'll do it for their marketplace sellers, why shouldn't they do it with their technology partners? [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-04-20/got-a-hot...

Buying a pair of shoes from another reseller doesn't make a difference.

It doesn't work for technologies. Changing systems is a huge cost and effort.

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#45
post #5

As a shareholder, hopefully never. Building infrastructure and platforms has three wonderful benefits: * Good customers, where good is defined as smart and willing to spend money. Going up the stack means dealing making sacrifices on both of those dimensions. * Less complex products that stay relevant longer. Amazon builds legos and leaves the task of putting them together to others. The assembly can create value, bu…

i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model. 1. good customers - infrastructure customers are not good customers. they are fickle and extremely price sensitive, which is tough to do on a super capital intensive business like hosting, even on amazon cloud's insanely high cost. 2. less complex products - i don't understand how there is there anything about amazon's cloud…

>i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model.

Moving up the chain doesn't plug weaknesses. It dilutes your focus and increases the number of competitors gunning for you.

The single worst business decision that Larry Ellison made was to acquire SAP. He looked at SAP's product, building on top of Oracle's databases, and thought, "Hey, that's value I can capture." The effect of that acquisition was to dilute Oracle's focus on its core product, which, in the long run, probably hurt Oracle more than its acquisition of SAP helped.

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model. 1. good customers - infrastructure customers are not good customers. they are fickle and extremely price sensitive, which is tough to do on a super capital intensive business like hosting, even on amazon cloud's insanely high cost. 2. less complex products - i don't understand how there is there anything about amazon's cloud…

>i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model. Moving up the chain doesn't plug weaknesses. It dilutes your focus and increases the number of competitors gunning for you. The single worst business decision that Larry Ellison made was to acquire SAP. He looked at SAP's product, building on top of Oracle's databases, and thought, "Hey, that's value I can capture." The eff…

Oracle never bought SAP. You are WRONG.

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model. 1. good customers - infrastructure customers are not good customers. they are fickle and extremely price sensitive, which is tough to do on a super capital intensive business like hosting, even on amazon cloud's insanely high cost. 2. less complex products - i don't understand how there is there anything about amazon's cloud…

>i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model. Moving up the chain doesn't plug weaknesses. It dilutes your focus and increases the number of competitors gunning for you. The single worst business decision that Larry Ellison made was to acquire SAP. He looked at SAP's product, building on top of Oracle's databases, and thought, "Hey, that's value I can capture." The eff…

Are you thinking of the acquisition of PeopleSoft by Oracle[1]? SAP are not owned by Oracle.

[1] http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/press/017124_EN

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i don't think i agree. i think they're moving up the chain to plug weaknesses in their model. 1. good customers - infrastructure customers are not good customers. they are fickle and extremely price sensitive, which is tough to do on a super capital intensive business like hosting, even on amazon cloud's insanely high cost. 2. less complex products - i don't understand how there is there anything about amazon's cloud…

> they are fickle and extremely price sensitive Not at all. Most customers couldn't care less about money. There are numerous people who are price sensitive, the amateurs who are running a test app and complaining that digital ocean is cheaper, then move to the weirdest hoster they could find because that's only $2 a month. These are NOT AWS customers.

> Not at all. Most customers couldn't care less about money.

you're out of your mind.

customers at the high end care MORE about money, not less. the company spending $1 million/month on AWS is desperately looking for ways out. DESPERATELY. their entire business is being held hostage by amazon. jeff bezos has them by the balls and is squeezing harder and harder by the day. they have hired consultants to do the analysis, they have hired operations VPs to get them out, but they are failing. they are failing, and shoveling even more money to AWS every week, or their business goes dark.

they are doing this because one side of their business (doing stuff) is outpacing their intelligence on the other side (paying for infrastructure to do stuff). this is the genius of amazon. this is why they are successful. amazon can arbitrage this opportunity better than anyone else currently.

how do i know? i compete with amazon and talk to customers on a weekly basis. they are desperate. they woke up one day and are are now sending their entire profit margin to jeff bezos. every single CFO is thinking about it. how panicked are they?

you could cut their bill in half and they still wouldn't do it. they're scared, like a deer in the headlights. they don't know what to do. what if they make a wrong decision? ohhhhh my goddddddddd but... let's do nothing and keep our jobs. that's the reality. meanwhile, s3 can go down for half a day, and amazon doesn't even really have to acknowledge it. becuase what are the customers going to do? MOVE? LOL! you might as well ask them to build a time machine.

that is real. people live in that reality. sometimes against their will. people care about costs, and try hard, and all of those nice things, but they will soon be losers because jeff bezos is just BETTER at business than they are. jeff bezos is literally being paid by the people he is about to put out of business at the application level, and they're happy to pay him to do it. it's amazing. it truly is.

here's the problem: more people know how to click a button on console.aws.amazon.com than to migrate and operate an entire site. people simply do not have the skills. they just don't. they don't know how the internet actually works, but they're operating a business on the internet. they're dumb. amazon capitalized on that, good for them.

maybe the era where needing to actually knowing how the internet works is over. i don't know.

Re: When Will AWS Move Up the Stack to Real Applications?

#50

Isn't amazon.com a real application? It seems to be working quite well for them. I'm not sure why they want to write applications for other people.

Because if one works well, why stop there? Amazon isn't some tech startup with only a few hackers to focus on supporting their core product. They can easily maintain support for their core offerings while building out/up. As to why: why not? In this day and age, why let anyone have a slice of something you have the recources and reach to do far better and cheaper than them?

One reason: Focus.

Anybody who has tried to launch a SAAS app knows that launching the software is not enough. The sales and support infrastructure has to be there as well.

I'm not saying they can't do it. They certainly have the money to throw at the problem. The question is if they really want to.

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