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New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

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Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#171
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not sure why this is downvoted. It highlights something very important.

He's highlighting something important, but I think it's the phrasing that's garnering the downvotes. The original comment didn't encourage high risk behavior or say anything about ignoring the risk of STDs.

I don't think I don't deserve them tbh, I was being super glib/lazy. I interpreted the parent as implying that was going to be "job done" for getting a child prepared and it struck me as odd.

Personally I would preach Condoms over pills (although I freely acknowledge they can fail, and indeed suspect it's even more likely when teens are the ones using them).

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#172

There is a lot of social commentary on this thread. Unanswered however is, "How will this affect relationships between men and women"? The "MGTOW" crowd laud this development, arguing that once control of fertility is in the hands of men rather than women (a woman can always "forget" to take the pill)... something good, as they define it, will happen. (IANAMGTOW - I am not a MGTOW) In terms of total fertility rate, w…

How is any of that different from the contraceptives that already exist?

Further, your notion of "Idiocracy" (believing that the "smart hardworking people" have fewer kids) doesn't match at all with the fact that IQ keeps rising in every generation in the US, and fewer people are poor or jobless than they were in the 50s or before.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#173
post #152
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably difficult because you don't have children and therefore lack the experience necessary to develop a comprehensive understanding of the topic. That's not to say your partial understanding is not valid, it's just incomplete. Not only am I adopted (thus not "wanted"), but neither of my children were planned and my wife and I initially couldn't agree. From my real world experience, and not speculation, it on…

> Not only am I adopted (thus not "wanted") So are you saying that, despite the effort, time, and money it takes for adoption, your adoptive parents didn't want you? That doesn't make any sense. While it might be true that your birth parent(s) didn't want you, there might be reasons why that is so; of course, I can't speak to that as I don't know your situation. What I can say, though, is that my parents wanted me wh…

To be honest, I think children adopted very early in life would have better childhoods than children raised by their birth parents because

p(parents are generous/caring/loving | parents are the type of person to adopt a child) > p(parents are generous/caring/loving | parents bring pregnancy to term)

In addition, for adopted parents, we know that both parents want the child. Whereas with birth parents, we know that the mother wanted a child but we do not know if the father did.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#174
post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Glad you asked. So India in general has an extremely progressive acceptability for sex education. We have ads on national TV promoting condoms (by the govt. With Bollywood jingles) as well as female contraceptives. You can pretty much walk into any govt hospital (which are not much to look at) and get free contraceptives and contraception operative procedures. We have a huge govt funded initiative around sanitary nap…

Well, India is different I think because it's a matter of national importance. I guess the Indian government really has no other option besides forcing the idea of contraceptives onto the population. This is not a bad thing, but I just want to clarify that overpopulation is a very strong motivator, and is something that few countries in the world have to deal with.

Few Western countries. Population is a huge problem in much of Asia. We should all praise the success of Bangladesh in addressing the problem so quickly, they really dodged a bullet there.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#175
post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Glad you asked. So India in general has an extremely progressive acceptability for sex education. We have ads on national TV promoting condoms (by the govt. With Bollywood jingles) as well as female contraceptives. You can pretty much walk into any govt hospital (which are not much to look at) and get free contraceptives and contraception operative procedures. We have a huge govt funded initiative around sanitary nap…

Well, India is different I think because it's a matter of national importance. I guess the Indian government really has no other option besides forcing the idea of contraceptives onto the population. This is not a bad thing, but I just want to clarify that overpopulation is a very strong motivator, and is something that few countries in the world have to deal with.

i agree. Population is an existential crisis here and that probably breaks through mental barriers.

Having said that, I would also say that contraception (and its weird, twisted forms) are very much part of our culture ;)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Pregnant_King

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#176
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, there are a ton of people complaining that female contraception encourages people to have sex they shouldn't be having. It's not usually framed in terms of STDs, but I'm pretty sure the STD argument here is just a cover for a moralistic argument anyway.

How sad that arguing virtue for its own sake is now politically incorrect.

Might have something to do with those men who preach virtue having a tendency to be incriminated in soliciting illegal male prostitutes or fondling children.

Also regardless of political correctness, the US at least doesn't seem to have any problems ruining young people's lives in order to appease to religious groups demanding to dictate what consenting adults can and can't do to their own bodies.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#177
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree in the sense that an STD only has to impact your life whereas a child is virtually guaranteed to consume vastly more resources and go on to impact society at large. That said, you may be surprised to learn you can live a pretty normal life with a child.

If you define "normal" as "being like most people" then you probably can't live a normal life without a child.

I could argue that I live a better life without children. Others could easily argue the opposite, though.

My wife and I made the decision not to have children a long time ago, and we don't regret it in the slightest. What we have found, though, is that our friends and co-workers continue to have on-going "problems" with their children.

Issues of sickness, parent-teacher and other school things, dealing with unruliness or other behavioral problems, the on-going costs of raising kids, finding daycare, time off for activities - or simply picking the kids up from school, having to get a more expensive (larger) car(s) because of having a kid (or more kids)...it just goes on and on, all the way through (and sometimes beyond) high school graduation and college. If the parents are lucky, the kid goes to college and moves away. But increasingly, that doesn't seem to be the case - we hear and see about many parents (friends, co-workers, and strangers) whose children stay at home, without a job. So they (the parents) continue to complain about that, wondering when their children will leave, or get a better education, or whatever.

It's gets tiresome after a while; it is also tiresome that you want to tell them about something you bought, or something you're doing or going to do (a vacation, higher education, a new job opportunity, or a business venture) - but you sometimes have to hold back, because you know that you're just throwing it in their faces that "this is what I have, and you don't because you're dealing with your kids".

...then there's the relief we've seen on our friend's and co-worker's faces when they (finally) say that their children have bought a house, and have moved out, or have a job, after graduating college or high-school or whatever; they look like a burden has been lifted from them (while at the same time a bit sad - I imagine because of their kids no longer being around - I can empathize with that).

It seems like children are a double-edged sword. Are there good times and good (great!) experiences to be had with children? Surely! I'll never know the thrill or excitement of teaching my child how to ride a bike, or use powertools, or how to code, or any number of other experiences (and there would be many). But with that loss, I also won't ever know the debt and trials children put parents through, the loss of time and energy, the fear when they don't come home on time.

I and my wife have chosen this; to say our life is abnormal because we came to that decision based on many discussions is to devalue our ability to make our own adult and independent decisions. Similarly, I can't honestly criticise someone for having children. All I do ask is to quit complaining about the decision(s) you made. Because that is the adult thing to do.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because morals are a good thing. Isn't it funny how all the real religions came to the same conclusion on all the controversial issues of our day.

Not all of them. Buddhism, for example, disagrees with several abrahamic religious conclusions on moral issues. Hinduism, I believe, has a caste system which doesn't exist as a moral controversial issue in abrahamic religions but is still a controversial issue in modern times for which Hinduism is a popular religion in the region. Abrahmix religions and Hinduism generally disagree on several moral issues, such as how…

Advocatus Diaboli: then Buddhism is obviously not a "real religion".

/s (for "scottish")

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#179

I wonder how this would effect STD rates in areas with bad sex ed? I could see a lot of people thinking 'don't need a condom because I can't make someone pregnant now'. Not that this product is a bad thing, very useful for people in monogamous relationships.

I can't see how it would have a positive effect. HIV infection rates in the gay community have shot up in recent years unfortunately as people have become complacent with condoms. Without the risk of pregnancy one can only assume the same thing will happen in the straight community.

There's a correlation between substance abuse (not addiction) and infections.

> “Chemsex is a rapidly emerging pattern of drug use, not just amongst men who have sex with men as often assumed, but heterosexual patients as well,” Dr Richard Ma of the Royal College of GPs’ Sex Drugs Group told the Telegraph. [https://www.rt.com/uk/320758-chemsex-hiv-outbreak-doctors/]

I see this as something related to the bar/disco/club culture rather than something linked to condoms.

Re: New male contraceptive may be submitted for Indian approval this year

#180

This is great. Friend of mine has been tricked by a woman into having a baby and now he has to give away most of his money in form of maintenance. He used a condom, but she emptied it inside her when he was asleep after the sex.

Old urban legend, that is notoriously hard to find any evidence of, and just so happens to nicely dovetail with the "Redpill" ideas about crazy, manipulative women.

If you didn't know the man in question, which would you find more likely: that a woman emptied a condom in herself in order to secretly make herself pregnant, in order to claim alimony; or that the couple failed to practice safe sex correctly (either through omission or due to an accident)?

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