Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber • Hacker News Board

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#281

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 12:57 AM UTC

rodgerd wrote: post #239

nilkn wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your opinions have consequences. They can affect other people in real ways. In this case, the imprecise, incredibly untrustworthy outrage of thousands of people -- fueled by a sensationalist media hit job -- almost ruined someone's career. You're welcome to your opinion. But you also have to take responsibility for it.

> almost ruined someone's career. Yeah, and people saying "Death to Jews" managed to murder six million of them. Yet apparently you think that is funny and beyond reproach, while taking issue with it is a serious problem.

[deleted]

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#282

Post by majani » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 1:16 AM UTC

basisword wrote: post #59

Does anyone here spend much of their usual 'entertainment' time watching YouTube (specifically content creators not TED talks and such)? I started doing it recently just to see what all the fuss is about as it seems pretty common for younger people (and I'm 26 so it's not like I'm old but I didn't do it). After subscribing to a few channels I started watching stuff regularly. Basically if I want to kill 10 mins I'll…

I personally made huge leaps in empathy from watching boogie2988's videos about his struggles with weight.

It's important to note, however, that YouTube is first and foremost a kids network(kids video ads convert the best), and then secondarily a music network(music videos provide most of the audience growth). All the rest of the stuff comes way after those two in their priority list, so you have to wade through all the screamy reaction channels and music channels to scrape something wholesome for adults at the bottom of the barrel.

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#283

Post by wingerlang » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 4:14 AM UTC

Obi_Juan_Kenobi wrote: post #270

wingerlang wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like that article was just a bunch of more or less hypothetical scenarios where X did Y and then some other characters being in "our time" and yada yada. I still have no idea what JonTron did, I guess he said something racist ... somewhere?

He had a debate that was cast on Twitch. Pretty good overview here (the subreddit is clearly hostile to Jon's opinions, but the original post is quality): https://www.reddit.com/r/ShitAmericansSay/comments/5z676o/we... A major highlight: > We've gotten rid of discrimination in our western countries. If you don't think we've gotten rid of discrimination, you're living in a fantasy land.

Thank you! The first sentence and the first 5 seconds of the video gave me a better overview than anything else.

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#284

Post by mcguire » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 4:45 AM UTC

watwut wrote: post #178

mcguire wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" The Internet has warped the idea of “free speech” to mean “speech without consequence” and that’s simply not what it is. " The true meaning of freedom is that you are free to do what you want, if you are willing to accept the consequences.

By that logic, everything everywhere is free if you are willing to accept the consequences. How reasonable the consequences of action are should be somehow part of the definition of freedom. You are free to say that, just accept that someone can beat you up for it or harass your employer/girlfriend/boyfriend till they fire you or ...

That is how freedom is inalienable. :)

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#285

Post by raesene6 » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 7:22 AM UTC

fixermark wrote: post #230

raesene6 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh I wasn't suggesting that what he said wasn't meant to be provocative, the main instance they picked up was ill considered and in bad taste, but then if you watch any of his other videos this really shouldn't be a surprise. The hit job was some of the other items they'd cut together to make the "anti-semetic" charge stick. One item where he was comparing youtube policies to those of the Nazi's (i.e. casting both in…

A recurring pattern I've seen with online celebrities is that when they get popular enough for more mainstream media to notice them, they're suddenly held to the standards of mainstream sensibilities and judged in a mainstream light that can be very incompatible with their brand. And their fans then defend them with "If you've seen their other stuff, you'd know that isn't unusual," which is a pretty thin defense---a…

My defence of that point wasn't predictated on the idea that what he said was atypical of his content.

It was predicated on the fact that WSJ took statements completely out of context to have the exact opposite of the in-context meaning.

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#286

Post by CommanderData » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 8:36 AM UTC

dragontamer wrote: post #253

CommanderData wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The pewdiepie controversy seems manufactured to me. I get pewdiepies humor. I watch his videos anticipating his originality and I guess 54 million subs do for varying reasons. His ability to express himself and generate content that makes me laugh repeatedly. He's not insensitive despite what some news articles say. The anti-semitism thing is so overused today its a little meaningless. The only way to push its worth…

> It's reached a point it feels he's holding back something funny to please WSJ - a huge, huge tragedy and loss to his freedom and originality. On the contrary. Its completely acceptable for PDP to say whatever he hell he wants. The problem is that he wants to be paid by Disney while doing it. The USA has freedom of speech. PDP is legally allowed to say whatever he wants. Unfortunately, PDP's revenue stream is (or pe…

What's interesting is ignoring his audience that identifies his sense of humor and understands the context of 'Death to all Jews'.

He wants what most people want, to make a living and Disney withdrawing as sponsor will likely not hurt. A bigger issue is WSJ and co efforts to have his ads pulled altogether.

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#287

Post by nailer » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 9:32 AM UTC

watwut wrote: post #211

nailer wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They definitely shouldn't have him under the 'Disney' brand: his humor is for gamers not children. But Disney does Marvel Studios, Buena Vista, Star Wars and a bunch of other stuff.

Star Wars is PG-13 (just checked).

Not sure that really changes the point: Disney has a bunch of things aimed at different age ranges, just not using the Disney brand.

The latest X men film, 'Logan' is R 18, as was the previous one. And Buena Vista have a bunch of dramas aimed at adults.

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#288

Post by fwn » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 10:07 AM UTC

fwn wrote: post #197

crooked-v wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really that surprising that Disney thought that using "death to all Jews" in a joke, regardless of context, was inappropriate?

"regardless of context" does not even exist. Your comment featured it and I don't think it's an inappropriate comment you made here.

Replying to myself, since I can not edit it anymore.

I know it sounds all funny and stuff, but if someone is curious about how context, in this case at least the statements exposed curator pewdiepie, matters, Foucaults 1969 essay "What Is an Author?" is a great starting point to dig into:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_Is_an_Author%3F

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#289

Post by chiefalchemist » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 10:58 AM UTC

adrianratnapala wrote: post #256

fixermark wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ultimately, his freedom and originality haven't been impinged; if he wants to say whatever he wants, he can make and host his own videos. His freedom of speech doesn't override Disney's freedom of association or YouTube's freedom of the press; they're under no obligation to publish or promote anyone's content, and the counterweight to that is that people who don't like their policies can boycott them. But you're unli…

This is all correct -- but it underlines the awkward moral spot that Google (my employer) is in. Our incentive is to pay lip service to freedom of speech while taking the path of least resistance and censor to keep angry 3rd parties happy. You might think this shuts down only speech beyond the pale. But we are still rewarding those who act most offended, and our wisest course is to kowtow more and more. That stuff is…

If we stopped saying things that might "offend" someone somewhere there would be silence. What's interesting is, the more we try to silence certain voices, the louder their message gets. Does demonization (?) work? Does it back fire ? Take IS for instance. The stronger and more extreme the resistance (?) the stronger it gets.

I'm certainly not defending hate, etc. Just wondering - out loud - if the old countermeasure rules still apply.

Re: Reasons YouTubers keep imploding, from a YouTuber

#290

Post by almostarockstar » Tue, Mar 28, 2017, 12:12 PM UTC

>On a platform that changes its rules on the fly, all the time.

Is there, or has there ever been, a platform that doesn't change the rules on the fly, all the time? I'm not talking about video alone. Tastes in comedy, music, film, and books change yearly. The requirements to become successful on any platform are always in flux and never totally clear. Survivorship bias abounds.

Also, I have very little sympathy for anybody making videos about gaming. Mindless drivel. If you can't keep up, it's because the market is saturated and your product or execution is not as good as your competitors.