The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban • Hacker News Board

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#21

Post by jawngee » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:20 PM UTC

camillomiller wrote: post #4

CoolGuySteve wrote: post #2

According to this Guardian article, the ban was caused by a plan to hide a bomb in an iPad: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/mar/26/plot-explosive... I always thought it was weird that you could keep an iPad packed in your carry on but a laptop had to be scanned separately even if it was a similar size to an iPad.

Every security check in Europe and SE Asia I passed in the last few years (~60 flights) mandated to take every device out of the bag, iPads and smartphones included

Hmm. I live in Vietnam and fly out of country once or twice a month and I've never been asked to take an iPad out of my bag.

I fly SGP, SGN, BKK, TPE. SGN did have me remove my shoes last time I flew though, which was a first.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#22

Post by londons_explore » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:20 PM UTC

makomk wrote: post #17

junto wrote: post #15

> Why not require passengers to turn their laptops on as they go through security? That would be a more effective security measure than forcing them to check them in their luggage. The reason that security checks aren't going to ask you to turn your laptop, ipad or mobile on, as a standard process, is that it takes too much time.

The other reason is that it's going to be of limited use these days, since I'm pretty sure some devices such as iPads effectively have multiple cells in parallel and should power on just fine with all but one of them replaced with explosives.

Also those laptops with detachable screens, which then operate as tablets.

There clearly isn't any critical hardware in the base bit...

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#23

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:21 PM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #5

Unlike all the other restrictions on material allowed in-flight recently, this ban only applies to specific airports/countries. One must ask why shoebomber or liquid explosive plots resulted in universal bans while this one is country-specific. Imho this is business and politics. This everyday safety mesure is being applied selectively in order to disadvantage some and advantage others. If ipads are a threat, ban the…

[deleted]

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#24

Post by justavoice » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:24 PM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #5

Unlike all the other restrictions on material allowed in-flight recently, this ban only applies to specific airports/countries. One must ask why shoebomber or liquid explosive plots resulted in universal bans while this one is country-specific. Imho this is business and politics. This everyday safety mesure is being applied selectively in order to disadvantage some and advantage others. If ipads are a threat, ban the…

or maybe the threat is from a specific geography, and they are trying to inconvenience as few people as possible?

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#25

Post by lostboys67 » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:27 PM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #5

Unlike all the other restrictions on material allowed in-flight recently, this ban only applies to specific airports/countries. One must ask why shoebomber or liquid explosive plots resulted in universal bans while this one is country-specific. Imho this is business and politics. This everyday safety mesure is being applied selectively in order to disadvantage some and advantage others. If ipads are a threat, ban the…

Or those airports have poor security or are at risk of penetration by bad actors.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#26

Post by junto » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:29 PM UTC

StavrosK wrote: post #20

junto wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But El Al is also profiling passengers before they even reach the airport. They stop people on route and question them to gain any subtle clues as to whether people might be nervous or acting strangely. They know weird shit like who you've met after being in Israel. A gay friend of a friend went to Tel Aviv Pride, and was taken aside and asked why he'd chosen to sleep with an Arab as he was leaving the country.

The hell? How did they know that?

Apparently he had absolutely no idea, but it completely freaked him out.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#27

Post by tehlike » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:30 PM UTC

lostboys67 wrote: post #25

sandworm101 wrote: post #5

Unlike all the other restrictions on material allowed in-flight recently, this ban only applies to specific airports/countries. One must ask why shoebomber or liquid explosive plots resulted in universal bans while this one is country-specific. Imho this is business and politics. This everyday safety mesure is being applied selectively in order to disadvantage some and advantage others. If ipads are a threat, ban the…

Or those airports have poor security or are at risk of penetration by bad actors.

As someone who flies through istanbul once a year, i was always surprised by the fact that there is very little security at us airports. :)

I think it is more about penetration possibility more so than airport sevurity itself.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#28

Post by croon » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:31 PM UTC

lostboys67 wrote: post #25

sandworm101 wrote: post #5

Unlike all the other restrictions on material allowed in-flight recently, this ban only applies to specific airports/countries. One must ask why shoebomber or liquid explosive plots resulted in universal bans while this one is country-specific. Imho this is business and politics. This everyday safety mesure is being applied selectively in order to disadvantage some and advantage others. If ipads are a threat, ban the…

Or those airports have poor security or are at risk of penetration by bad actors.

Or not. I've never had them check my laptop once (other than the scans) in any airport I've been through, and that's quite a few. (Not that I haven't seen it done though)

This isn't about an assessment on airport capabilities in laptop security vetting.

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#29

Post by gommm » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:31 PM UTC

captainmuon wrote: post #6

One explanation I haven't heard, is that this is about the idea that somebody could hack a plane from the passenger compartment. There doesn't even have to be evidence of a concrete plan - it would be enough for someone who knows about these kind of attacks to get the ear of somebody influential in the government, who then proactively enacts this ban. (The hacking story might be a good pretext to convince people inte…

In that case they could just do it from a phone... Honestly, the only reason I can see that makes sense is that it helps American airlines and is going to cause significant losses to the big Middle Eastern 3 airlines..

Any argument regarding security can be countered by just taking a flight that routes through Europe

Re: The TSA's Selective Laptop Ban

#30

Post by londons_explore » Mon, Mar 27, 2017, 1:33 PM UTC

wwwv wrote: post #9

raverbashing wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some (older) laptops were sandwiched between thick metal panes, for EMC and mechanical reasons Probably not very transparent to x-rays

Completely transparent as far as a luggage X-ray is concerned, they're very high power because they don't have to care about exposure limits like medical imaging would. They usually have multiple attenuators and detectors so they can do neat tricks like detection of organic materials.

But they usually can't detect an organic material behind a varying thickness metal plate.

And metal in laptops is often varying thickness (either due to the design, or poor manufacturing tolerance), hence the concerns that organic explosives can be hidden in their "xray shadow".