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The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

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Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#341

Post by timoth »

vidarh wrote: post #269
alkonaut wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> None of the Nordic countries have taxes as high as the ones you outline above for average earners, though it is possible in some instances if you're earning substantially above average. Yes, I'm above average income for Sweden. Roughly my employer pays 1/4 payroll and 3/4 to me as gross salary. I pay 1/3 tax on gross salary and keep. 2/3. That means the net share of the employers' expense is roughly (2/3)x(3/4) whi…

> (Which is surprisingly close to the figure you had there of 42.7%) I've cross checked the OECD numbers many times, and they are very precise. Any discrepancy tend to be year to year changes in deductions etc. > Oh: A source of great injustice in Sweden is that renters (predominantly low income earners) don't deduct interest rate expenses of those who own property (their landlords) while those who own their property…

The UK had tax relief for mortgage interest payments for a while as well, but it was abolished in 2000:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mortgage_interest_relief_at_so...

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#342

Post by JohnLeTigre »

Typically 2/3rd of expenses in companies go into salaries. That's a huge chunk of money.

Somebody finds a system that reduces the salarial expenses to zero and all the hard-capitalists are over-joyed, secretly dreaming that they could apply this model to their own business.

In the mean time workers, while owning the means of production, are still liable to pay all the running expenses, to invest their time and work and give a percentage to a stranger, for some odd reason.

This is a form of feudalism.

I am not anti-capitalist, but I fear that this form of economy on the long run will not allow individuals to flourish economically through the merit of their work.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#343

Post by lilbobbytables »

alkonaut wrote: post #112
J-dawg wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to disagree with the parent comment (because overall I prefer the European way) but we do have it worse in some ways. Salaries for professionals are markedly lower, we live in much smaller houses etc. I get the feeling that when you're winning at life in America, you're really winning. But when you're losing you're really losing. In Europe the ups and downs of life are more smoothed out.

> Salaries for professionals are markedly lower, we live in much smaller houses etc. This is an age old debate, and it's very hard to compare one vast continent to another. Regional differences between US cities and European cities are at least as large or larger than the difference between the avereages of US and European salaries/living standards etc. The difference between central manhattan and rural Apalachia is…

I'd imagine, without putting much thought into it, that when you compare salaries, and then account for how much more is paid in taxes in (most) European countries, then at least parts of the comparison can get voided - like retirement savings or something of that nature.

If you're working as a professional in the US it's pretty rare that your health insurance isn't at least mostly paid for by your employer, if not completely paid for by them.

But like you said, that's why it's a tricky calculation. All of which varies if you're single or married with children.

I'd imagine that for the young and healthy people without children, it isn't hard to sock away more in the US.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#344

Post by shokunin »

onion2k wrote: post #100
J-dawg wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to disagree with the parent comment (because overall I prefer the European way) but we do have it worse in some ways. Salaries for professionals are markedly lower, we live in much smaller houses etc. I get the feeling that when you're winning at life in America, you're really winning. But when you're losing you're really losing. In Europe the ups and downs of life are more smoothed out.

Salaries for professionals are markedly lower, we live in much smaller houses etc. I get the feeling that when you're winning at life in America... If having more money and a bigger house is winning that's true, but many people don't see life that way. Being happy, having time to enjoy life with your friends, doing worthwhile and interesting things, raising your kids well, etc are also ways to win. In general if you…

Yeah, try enjoying your time with friends and long vacations with no money in your pocket. Fuck Berlin.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#345

Post by bunburying »

conanbatt wrote: post #190
alkonaut wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Salaries for professionals are markedly lower, we live in much smaller houses etc. This is an age old debate, and it's very hard to compare one vast continent to another. Regional differences between US cities and European cities are at least as large or larger than the difference between the avereages of US and European salaries/living standards etc. The difference between central manhattan and rural Apalachia is…

A software engineer in a startup in berlin earns maybe a median salary of 60k euros ayear at a 40% tax rate. Thats less of what interns make in the us at a 30% tax rate. An experienced engineer at google or facebook make 200k with a sizable signup bonus. As far as I know, theres no comparison between what a soft dev makes in the us and what he makes in europe. This is from someone that lives in south america, and is…

As a former Googler who was involved in comparing pay across Google sites, Zurich was on par with Mountain View in gross pay (and ahead of New York), and after-tax pay was markedly higher in Zurich.

While Berlin is a great city, it is very far from being a top-pay city in Europe.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#346

Post by fjdlwlv »

JohnLeTigre wrote: post #342

Typically 2/3rd of expenses in companies go into salaries. That's a huge chunk of money. Somebody finds a system that reduces the salarial expenses to zero and all the hard-capitalists are over-joyed, secretly dreaming that they could apply this model to their own business. In the mean time workers, while owning the means of production, are still liable to pay all the running expenses, to invest their time and work a…

The "odd" reason is that that the "stranger" makes a huge contribution. That's why people weren't runnning nearly so many personal car services before Uber.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#347

Post by fjdlwlv »

ikurei wrote: post #89
piva00 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Calvinism influenced the Netherlands a lot, I'm not really so much versed in Calvinism in America but if you want to compare I'd suggest starting there. Even more interesting because I consider Netherlands the closest you get in Continental Europe to a Scandinavian country (socially/economically speaking).

Isn't it also true that in Scandinavia religion started losing ground earlier and faster than in the rest of the West? As far as I know, religion is barely relevant for most scandinavians (apart from the influence it has had on all western culture, of course), whereas it still greatly influences the worldview of most americans. May be protestantism is the origin of this kind of work ethics, probably exacerbated by am…

Scandinavia was never conquered by the Christian (or Muslim) church to the same extent as mainland Europe.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#348

Post by hellofunk »

xienze wrote: post #339
rorykoehler wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really not the same thing. America always feels like America. Travelling in the US is no substitute to travelling abroad.

Believe me, there are plenty of places in the US you could go where you'll say "holy shit, this is AMERICA???"

It's still not the same thing as going to another country where everything is different, the shows on TV, the language, the politics, the food. You will find variety within the bounds of any nation on earth, but it's not as great as the variety between nations.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#349

Post by hellofunk »

Aaargh20318 wrote: post #239
dukeluke wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sad to say that your experience with PTO is not the norm in the US. The lower and most of the middle classes have it much worse: http://theweek.com/articles/463897/americas-war-vacation-by-...

To clarify: I live in the Netherlands and I was disagreeing with the fact that everyone takes off 4-6 weeks to travel around the world each summer. Most people only get 5 weeks of holiday a year total (4 weeks is the legal minimum) and they usually spread out those days over the year. If you can travel the world for 6 weeks every summer then you have an above-average number of free days and probably an above-average…

I said 4 - 6 weeks; you are focusing on the "6" but I know many, many Dutch (my neighbors, actually) who are gone a full month every summer, like clockwork. Nearly everyone on my street. It's always either July or August.

You say people "only" get 5 weeks of holiday, but that only supports my main point about the huge difference between that and what Americans are used to.

Re: The Gig Economy Celebrates Working To Excess

#350

Post by JohnLeTigre »

fjdlwlv wrote: post #346
JohnLeTigre wrote: post #342

Typically 2/3rd of expenses in companies go into salaries. That's a huge chunk of money. Somebody finds a system that reduces the salarial expenses to zero and all the hard-capitalists are over-joyed, secretly dreaming that they could apply this model to their own business. In the mean time workers, while owning the means of production, are still liable to pay all the running expenses, to invest their time and work a…

The "odd" reason is that that the "stranger" makes a huge contribution. That's why people weren't runnning nearly so many personal car services before Uber.

It's an app
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