How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF • Hacker News Board

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#31

Post by jacquesm » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 1:59 AM UTC

imglorp wrote: post #24

robk wrote: post #2

That seems like a very reasonable process. Nothing unusual anyways.

The only part I take exception to is the hyperbolic kill portion of, "intent to kill, injure, harass..." of the complaint. Seizures are unpleasant, inconvenient, and you might get injured on the way to the ground but they are rarely fatal, and if the victim was known to be at risk of such, he would be in an ICU somewhere. Did the perpetrator intend to kill? That might be hard to prove.

> “Spammed this at [victim] let’s see if he dies,”

Seizures can kill and this is widely known, so widely that we got instruction in high school on how to deal with a seizure victim to make sure they don't die.

Surely someone sending a seizure inducing picture to someone they know is prone to seizures is well aware of the risk they are taking, they are definitely not doing it to give them a monitor induced suntan. See perps quote above, definitely a slam dunk for intent.

Griefers don't care about the damage they cause, the more the merrier.

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#32

Post by rjeli » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:02 AM UTC

tyingq wrote: post #5

Desktop browsers allow you to disable auto-playing animated images. I'm surprised mobile browsers don't seem to have this. If I suffered from this, I'd want some sort of reasonable protection from asshats.

Twitter's native app allows the user to disable autoplay.

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#33

Post by cxseven » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:02 AM UTC

danso wrote: post #8

Dumb question, but what is the meaning of AT&T "toll records" used to link the user to an iPhone 6? > "AT&T responded and a review of the subscriber information showed the telephone number was associated with a Tracfone prepaid account with no subscriber information. However, a review of the AT&T toll records showed an associated Apple iPhone 6A Model 1586" That is, if you are a Tracfone user and Tracfone uses AT&T t…

I think AT&T just logged the IMEI of the phone that used their towers, which I believe is sent as a standard part of the authentication packets the phone sends to the towers.

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#34

Post by beering » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:02 AM UTC

hatsunearu wrote: post #29

Page 11-12, Weird how he takes screenshots of random shit like his research on how to trigger epilepsy. Who researches shit and takes screenshots?

It's an easy way to send information to others. Maybe he was brainstorming ways to attack the victim with others and sent them screenshots of his research?

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#35

Post by jacquesm » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:02 AM UTC

This is as close to a real life 'snowcrash' as you could get and whoever did this (and the copycats) should be thrown the book at.

50K people die in the USA alone each year due to seizures, this is really no joking matter.

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#36

Post by cottsak » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:03 AM UTC

rjeli wrote: post #30

vmarsy wrote: post #15

From an article related to the case [1]: > charged with criminal cyberstalking with the intent to kill or cause bodily harm and faces a maximum sentence of 10 years in prison if convicted, What is even more sad: > More than 40 Twitter users sent similar strobes to Mr. Eichenwald after they realized they could trigger seizures, he tweeted Friday. The agent went through these steps to identify the suspect: - Asked Twit…

Wow, did not realize Apple is so gung-ho about sharing iCloud data with LE. I love the Apple ecosystem but when I have to start fracturing out my services it's going to suck. edit: should have read the post. Thought "ask" meant they handed it over willingly. Apple was served a search warrant, AT&T was not.

The FBI had a warrant

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#37

Post by mrspeaker » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:03 AM UTC

824ueirwfjd wrote: post #11

tyingq wrote: post #5

Desktop browsers allow you to disable auto-playing animated images. I'm surprised mobile browsers don't seem to have this. If I suffered from this, I'd want some sort of reasonable protection from asshats.

> reasonable protection from asshats Is there a strong argument that distinguishes this case of being "asshat on the internet" vs "homicidal with intent to kill"?

I was thinking about it like this: I could tamper with the brakes on your car, but there would only be a very very slight chance they would actually fail at a life-threatening moment... probably you'd realize they were faulty, and even if they did fail you'd probably be fine. I'd probably still be in trouble for it though.

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#38

Post by jacquesm » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:05 AM UTC

defen wrote: post #25

danso wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that the lesson? I would've guessed the lesson is to not try to murder people over the Internet. Makes sense why AT&T was asked for data. I'm interested in why Tracfone wasn't. But I guess if it's enough to have a phone number and suspicion that it belongs to an iPhone, that's enough to send a search warrant to Apple. Given the popularity of the iPhone, I wonder if law enforcement has the option of querying Apple…

Was trying to be witty, but really the lesson would apply to anyone trying to be anonymous on the Internet, including those who have more noble motives.

If you want to be anonymous on the internet and you are doing this for immediate and spontaneous reasons my advice to you would be to forget about whatever you were planning, likely you will not manage to maintain your anonymity.

If you have a lot of knowledge in this field and a fair amount of time to prepare you may be able to pull it off but chances are you will still get a detail wrong somewhere and find yourself lifted out of bed at 3 am.

In that case I hope you have a very good lawyer.

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#39

Post by caminante » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:08 AM UTC

imglorp wrote: post #24

robk wrote: post #2

That seems like a very reasonable process. Nothing unusual anyways.

The only part I take exception to is the hyperbolic kill portion of, "intent to kill, injure, harass..." of the complaint. Seizures are unpleasant, inconvenient, and you might get injured on the way to the ground but they are rarely fatal, and if the victim was known to be at risk of such, he would be in an ICU somewhere. Did the perpetrator intend to kill? That might be hard to prove.

The clauses aren't as strict. The criteria's merely intent to induce fear/distress.

> whoever (2) with the intent to kill, injure, harass, intimidate[...] or intimidate another person[...] in a course of conduct that—

> (A) places that person in reasonable fear of the death of or serious bodily injury to a person described in clause (i), (ii), or (iii) of paragraph (1)(A); or

> (B) causes, attempts to cause, or would be reasonably expected to cause substantial emotional distress to a person described in clause (i), (ii), or (iii) of paragraph (1)(A),

> shall be punished as provided... [0]

[0] https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2261A

Re: How police found Twitter user accused of sending seizure-triggering GIF

#40

Post by tyingq » Tue, Mar 21, 2017, 2:09 AM UTC

wavefunction wrote: post #26

tyingq wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would require insight we don't really have. Personally, I had no idea something like this would work. I assumed it would need something more powerful in intensity, like an actual strobe light. Maybe the suspect in this case knew it would work, maybe not.

The suspect specifically targeted the target because he said so in messages to some of his "fellow travelers" in whatever sorts of internet political circles he runs in.[0] I would urge you to do some reading on these sorts of events. Following the facts of the case can do wonders for your own arguments. [0] http://www.dallasnews.com/news/crime/2017/03/17/fbi-arrests-...

Yes, he did say things like ""I hope this sends him into a seizure" and "let's see if he dies." You can imagine, though, similar situations where that's puffery. There's also a pretty loose correlation between a seizure and death.

Edit: Should clarify that it's still atrocious, and seems criminal. Not convinced though, that it's clearly attempted murder. The charge is interesting in that the penalty is 10 years max, even though it speaks of intent to kill.