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David Rockefeller has died

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Re: David Rockefeller has died

#111

Post by teslabox »

CriticalSection wrote: post #53

> The Osteopathic profession was the only group that was organized enough to survive the Medical Guild's purge of non-Rockefeller-approved approaches to medicine. What? The Medical Guild purged (almost) all of the quacks and snake oil salesman out of medicine, and aimed American medicine to be directed by the scientific method and biology. This was a good thing. You're right, most of the quacks, snake handlers, anti-…

The Medical Guild didn't have much to offer in the early part of the 20th century. The Osteopaths [possibly] had much better results at their hospitals during the Great Flu of 1918, for example.

Science started to make some progress figuring things out, but then the snake oil salesmen regrouped and used the cloak of 'science' to sell their 'prescriptions'. For example, Statin drugs might prevent a few heart attacks, but just cause side effects for 90+% of the patients who take them.

Pfizer, et al, are trying to restore estrogen/Premarin (a prescription derived from PREgnant MARes' urIN [1]) to its former glory, even though estrogen treatment was always known by actual scientists to be harmful [2].

Robert Whitaker has provided an indictment of conventional psychiatry's use of 'snake oil' [3], and a science writer recently voted to indict [4].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premarin [2] http://web.archive.org/web/20110719210324/http://leda.law.ha... [3] https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/are-psychia... [4] https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/psychiatris...

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#112

Post by theseatoms »

rosser wrote: post #78
intended wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>When Flexner researched his report, many American medical schools were "proprietary", namely small trade schools owned by one or more doctors, unaffiliated with a college or university, and run to make a profit. A degree was typically awarded after only two years of study. Laboratory work and dissection were not necessarily required. Many of the instructors were local doctors teaching part-time, whose own training l…

> I mean, that's why we trust doctors, because the bar is that high. Two thoughts: 1. The old joke, "What do you call the person who graduated from medical school at the bottom of their class?" "Doctor." 2. The ordeal of residency isn't about setting the bar "high", nearly so much as it's about, "well, I went through this shit, so you have to, too". (Source: I have several doctor friends. All of them think it's bulls…

Regarding the second point, this is room for improvement for reducing healthcare costs by increasing the supply of doctors.

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#113

Post by reckoner2 »

charia wrote: post #2

Obligatory mention of Titan, in mine and many other people's opinion, the best and most comprehensive biography of the original John D. Rockefeller. (The grandfather of the David Rockefeller who passed away today.) An extremely well put together balanced analysis of John D. Rockefeller, Standard Oil and general history of the Gilded Age. http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/16121.Titan

I finished this a few nights ago. What a book. It took about 4 times as long to read as Steve Jobs, but it was absolutely worth it. Someone like John D. Rockefeller really is one in a billion. Highly Recommended.

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#114

Post by lqdc13 »

CriticalSection wrote: post #86
liber8 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that osteopaths were so well organized. It's that John D. was a devoted Osteopath for most of his life. If you haven't read Titan, it's a fascinating bio.

> John D. was a devoted Osteopath for most of his life. If you haven't read Titan, it's a fascinating bio. That's interesting, I didn't know that. More than osteopathy, the similar yet different practice of chiropractic is a better example of a legally and politically well-organized "alternative medicine". Through legal ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilk_v._American_Medical_Ass'n ) and political pressure from the 1…

I would like to point out that chiropractic medicine is not necessarily quackery. There are certainly some elements that may not always work, but there are also many things that do.

The classes in the schools are certainly not a joke - they take real anatomy and real body mechanics, real radiology and real biochemistry - and the requirements for graduation are not trivial.

Additionally, although scientific method has been successful in medicine, a lot is still not well understood from the bottom up. That's why some alternative medicine solutions sometimes work as well and even better than modern medicine. It was arrived at through centuries of trial and error.

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#116

Post by unityByFreedom »

laichzeit0 wrote: post #109

The primary goal of Islam, according to its doctrine, is to bring the law of Allah (known as Sharia) to all people on earth. Sharia is the right way to live, and all people should be subject to it. Please explain how you plan to "live together" when there are people who are actively pursuing an ideology that in no way, shape or form can be altered because it is the actual, literal, word of God himself and it must be…

(1) Not all Muslims believe that everyone needs to follow Sharia. I imagine you know this.

(2) Christianity is dogmatic too in the sense that it doesn't accept other religions. If you're not Christian, you're not saved.

> Thus, "learning to live together on the same planet" is a fool's errand if not everyone can agree that that is an allowable first principle. Islam clearly does not allow it as a first principle.

I'm sure you don't mean this as literally as you write it. Obviously we've already advanced to learn to live together quite well over thousands of years. How we continue to do that is perhaps where we disagree slightly, but I think you would agree that, while there are still tigers in the forest, they need not all be killed simply since one will kill you if he sees you.

Please stop acting like all Muslims are a threat. It's simply not true, and you only help ISIS' recruiting when you make Muslims feel unwelcome. America isn't going to deport all Muslims and you're going to have to learn to interact with them whether you like it or not.

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#117

Post by kevando »

>In 2008 Rockefeller gave $100 million to his alma mater, Harvard University in Cambridge, Massachusetts.

I have to agree with Malcom Gladwell on this... Of all the ways to donate $100M, OF ALL THE WAYS

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#118

Post by kolanos »

CriticalSection wrote: post #53

> The Osteopathic profession was the only group that was organized enough to survive the Medical Guild's purge of non-Rockefeller-approved approaches to medicine. What? The Medical Guild purged (almost) all of the quacks and snake oil salesman out of medicine, and aimed American medicine to be directed by the scientific method and biology. This was a good thing. You're right, most of the quacks, snake handlers, anti-…

John D. Rockefeller's father was literally a snake oil salesman [1].

1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Rockefeller_Sr.

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#119

Post by unityByFreedom »

bordercases wrote: post #75
unityByFreedom wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Over a long period of time? Why not. America is nearly 100% immigrants.

Most of them were White Christians for the longest time. Are people of that even temperament that you can't see differences between them?

Certainly I see differences in people's culture. I don't damn them for it.

Re: David Rockefeller has died

#120

Post by reckoner2 »

ravitation wrote: post #108
reckoner2 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I finished "Titan: The Life of John D. Rockefeller" a few nights ago. It's a mammoth of a book and I believe the undisputed most accurate and comprehensive look at his life. I think that what you've written here is incredibly misleading when talking about John D. Rockefeller's philanthropy in particular. It is wrong to imply the Rockefeller's secretly controlled strings in order to make profits from their donations.…

A question out of pure ignorance: the parent comment was speaking on David Rockefeller, did he (David Rockefeller) treat philanthropy in the same way (not just superficially) as his grandfather?

I'm ignorant about David Rockefeller as well. And it may be right to criticize David. But the parent comment was actually talking about events related to John D. Rockefeller's philanthropy, not David's. John D. Rockefeller did not pass on his wealth to his Son, let alone his grandson until after the events mentioned.

edit: for example: David was not even born when the Flexner report was released.

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