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The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

newyorker.com

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Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#61

Post by mabbo »

buro9 wrote: post #23
forvelin wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this related to fact that there are people who profit over correction services in United States ? After digging around VICE article[0], lack of rehab in US made bit sense at least. [0] - https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/whos-getting-rich-off-the...

It is bigger and deeper than just that. I've even seen comments on here regarding immigration that simply said if someone has ever been arrested then they shouldn't be allowed into the USA. (No qualifying statements on recency or severity, or even acquittal.) With regards to crime (including the mere accusation of sexual things) the sentiment of the USA runs counter to the aspiration and promise of social mobility of…

I've heard it said that much of it goes back to the Calvinists roots of American culture. The idea that there are good people and bad people, that you are one or the other.

Bad people deserve to go to prison, and therefore people in prison are all bad people. Why should any mercy by shown to bad people? Why should good people have to pay to help bad people? That sounds immoral.

By the same set of rules, good people deserve to be rich, so therefore rich people must be good.

It may not be correct, but it sure does seem to accurately describe how American culture works.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#62

Post by mistermann »

jacquesm wrote: post #49
igor_filippov wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait what? Isn't he innocent until proven otherwise?

He pretty much admitted it himself, what else do you want? Or do you feel that because he lies all the time we should not believe him at all, even when he incriminates himself? I'm fairly confident in declaring Trump guilty of that, this is not a court of law, it's an internet forum and the standards for both are different. In fact, the standards of proof for criminal law are different from those for civil law (see O…

Myself and half the guys and girls I grew up with are also guilty of sexual assault based on many people's current definition.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#63

Post by skissane »

The article mentions machines attached to young men's penises to "measure their arousal", a prosecutor demanding a photo of a teenage boy's erect penis, masturbation diaries – their so-called "therapy" sounds like a sexual assault in itself, sexual abuse committed by the state and its agents.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#64

Post by lb1lf »

gigatexal wrote: post #54
lb1lf wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

-Oh, there's no such thing as a perfect society, IMHO - but when it comes to crime and punishment, I do think the US could benefit from taking a leaf or two from our books. However, there are a couple of key differences (still IMHO!) which makes it difficult to compare the two. Most notably, perhaps - we do not elect judges. Nor do we elect police chiefs. The latter are positions you apply for as you would any other;…

I didn't mean to insinuate that Europe was perfect just that there are things we could learn that would help us one of which is the rehab vs throw-away-the-key approach to prisoners.

Oops, my bad - my intent was simply to acknowledge that we old-worlders do have a thing or two to learn from our former colonies, too.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#65

Post by alistproducer2 »

gillianlish wrote: post #28

lets be clear. rich people do not have to deal with this. denny hastert rapes a bunch of people and is still thought of as a good guy by the powerful and wealthy. how many more like him are protected? catholic church institutionalizes criminal sexual abuse but nobody in management goes to prison. corey feldman knows who raped him but cannot say it because that person has too much money and power in hollywood. hedge f…

On a similar note, Florida (and I'm sure other states) have laws that prevent government employees and their relatives' mugshots from being public records. [1]

1: http://www.wctv.tv/news/headlines/1247277.html

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#66

Post by saiya-jin »

Odenwaelder wrote: post #6

The US are getting weirder and weirder and weirder. I just can't wrap my head around Trump, gun laws, life-time sex-offender registries, the messed up health care system. Yet, I have only met absolutely nice, intelligent, loving americans, and I've met many. I feel sorry for them. They deserve better.

I agree with that apart from gun laws - happy to see any hard data on that, but so far none - terrorists don't buy their guns in gun shops.

you have whole industry, more in US than elsewhere but it's present in every country of people doing target practice, hunting, having guns for their home protection. millions of people worldwide.

banning guns just takes them from hands of common citizens while ever-more-and-more oppressive state is being more and more militarized. I get the perspective of the state - total control and dominance over its population, like it or not. but I am on the population side, same as rest of us.

even as a foreigner I find US constitution a great idea that shouldn't be compromised on, especially in these difficult times.

what EU did recently - ban on various guns and overall more restrictions is stupid. just look at Switzerland - the most armed and most free country in the world. I am not claiming whole world should take them as model for everything, but west should for most of things, since they really work, already proven.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#67

Post by inetknght »

bambax wrote: post #16

> Her friend, who had just given birth to a baby girl, had logged on to the Michigan Public Sex Offender Registry Web site to search for local predators. "Sex-offender" registry is of course a total and complete abomination. But if you're going to write against it, maybe you owe it to yourself and your readers to not use the words of the enemy -- namely "predators". There are no "predators". There may or may not be p…

> There are no "predators"

Unfortunately, you're wrong. While there might be far fewer actual predators than the registry supposes, there are indeed actual predators on the list. The problem is that the registry is abused by law enforcement and the public through misunderstanding and continued by lack of intellectual integrity. Why read any public case notes of convictions when all you need to know is that they're on the registry? It takes so much _time_ to actually find out _why_ someone's on the registry. It takes a lot of thinking to actually figure out "hey this person was simply exploring their sexuality and no harm was intended". Why spend time and thought on that when you can just assume the worst and let someone else worry about truth?

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#68

Post by pc86 »

bambax wrote: post #16

> Her friend, who had just given birth to a baby girl, had logged on to the Michigan Public Sex Offender Registry Web site to search for local predators. "Sex-offender" registry is of course a total and complete abomination. But if you're going to write against it, maybe you owe it to yourself and your readers to not use the words of the enemy -- namely "predators". There are no "predators". There may or may not be p…

> There are no "predators"

This is just as wrong as saying that everyone on the registry is a predator. Of course everyone isn't. But there absolutely are many violent rapists, pedophiles, etc on those registries. Plenty of people who made a mistake or got caught without a Romeo & Juliet law in their state, but also plenty of sexually violent predators.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#69

Post by pc86 »

stagbeetle wrote: post #48
gillianlish wrote: post #28

lets be clear. rich people do not have to deal with this. denny hastert rapes a bunch of people and is still thought of as a good guy by the powerful and wealthy. how many more like him are protected? catholic church institutionalizes criminal sexual abuse but nobody in management goes to prison. corey feldman knows who raped him but cannot say it because that person has too much money and power in hollywood. hedge f…

This is strawmanning and hyperbole. Hastert "cannot be prosecuted for sexual abuse because the statute of limitations has expired for his conduct decades earlier."[0] This also goes against the ethos of the article. Hastert apologized (although this cannot make up for heinous deeds) for his conduct and showed regret. If we believe for the sake of argument that he is truly sorrowful and wants to turn over a new leaf,…

> If we believe for the sake of argument that he is truly sorrowful and wants to turn over a new leaf, who are you to deny him this?

While personally I am in favor of these types of registries (ideally with quite a few changes), the argument is that if you are placed on a lifetime offender list, you can be as sorrowful as you want, you can never turn over a new leaf. You effectively have a life sentence even if you never had to step foot inside a jail cell.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#70

Post by hythloday »

sgift wrote: post #19
lb1lf wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. In Norway (heck, in Scandinavia, and, is my impression, in most of North/Central Europe, too), there's strong focus on rehabilitation. Inmates are encouraged to pursue education while incarcerated. If you want to enter a trade, there are workshops &c in the prisons where you can do your apprenticeship. Also, in all but the (rare) cases where you are deemed to be a lasting danger to society, you are automaticall…

> That being said, liberal me still feel somewhat less lenient towards paedophiles; I guess any parent does. It's a sickness. And we have (mental) hospitals for sick people. Problem solved, no leniency required.

We've thought exactly the same in the past about depression, homosexuality, unmarried mothers and outspoken women, but yes, maybe this time medicalizing something before we know much about it is the right answer and won't make us look like abhorrent barbarians to our grandchildren.
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