The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence • Hacker News Board

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#11

Post by lucideer » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:00 AM UTC

pluma wrote: post #5

gigatexal wrote: post #4

Well if the predilection towards pedophilia could be managed or "cured" and if prisons did more than just house inmates I.e if they worked on rehab instead of punishment then perhaps the lifetime listings wouldn't be necessary. I won't begin to insinuate that I have the right balance between parents wanting to be cautious with who their kids interact with and the belief that people can change for the better. And then…

> if prisons did more than just house inmates The problem is that the US system in particular is obsessed with punishment alone. Yes, sure, sometimes the punishment is justified as a learning experience but it's entirely based on the idea that punishment alone is sufficient to teach and act as a deterrent to others. Considering mental health (especially for the poor) is fairly neglected as a public health issue in th…

> highest incarceration rate in the "free world"

2nd highest in the world full stop is a starker figure (behind Seychelles which has a population <10k)

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#12

Post by sersi » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:00 AM UTC

In the fight against the great boogeymen of Terrorism and Sex Predation, the US has lost common sense.

As a kid, when I was 8 years old, I played doctor with my neighbor, we we were both curious about each others differences and so we explored them. So, if I read this article, if this had been in the US, we could have been tried as sex offenders? How does this even make sense? Of course kids are curious about body differences between men and women.

And, when I read those stories, I really don't understand how a teenager could be convicted for having sex with a girl 2 or 3 years younger than her. I can't imagine how a girl sexting could be convicted for producing "Child Porn", that absolutely makes no sense.

And then the treatments describe are a form of abuse. I wouldn't want to be subject to a “penile plethysmograph”.

It's really scary how easily it is to pass Orwellian by invoking "Think of the Children" or "To prevent terrorists". As soon as those two things are uttered, people seem to lose all common sense.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#13

Post by gigatexal » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:02 AM UTC

lb1lf wrote: post #9

gigatexal wrote: post #4

Well if the predilection towards pedophilia could be managed or "cured" and if prisons did more than just house inmates I.e if they worked on rehab instead of punishment then perhaps the lifetime listings wouldn't be necessary. I won't begin to insinuate that I have the right balance between parents wanting to be cautious with who their kids interact with and the belief that people can change for the better. And then…

This. In Norway (heck, in Scandinavia, and, is my impression, in most of North/Central Europe, too), there's strong focus on rehabilitation. Inmates are encouraged to pursue education while incarcerated. If you want to enter a trade, there are workshops &c in the prisons where you can do your apprenticeship. Also, in all but the (rare) cases where you are deemed to be a lasting danger to society, you are automaticall…

America is hell-bent on not being like Europe even given the good there is to learn from.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#14

Post by kobeya » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:03 AM UTC

I have a friend who plead guilty to two statuary rape charges that were false accusations, serving more time with parole than the maximum sentencing of the one charge he was guilty of, solely because the prosecution would drop the request for sex-offender registration, which would have done him permanent harm.

There are some real predators out there, and I understand the threats that make something like a registry necessary. However it has become a tool of the plea-deal legal industry and a mechanism by which non-predatory individuals have had their lives ruined by the state.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#15

Post by kobeya » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:03 AM UTC

I have a friend who plead guilty to two statuary rape charges that were false accusations, serving more time with parole than the maximum sentencing of the one charge he was guilty of, solely because the prosecution would drop the request for sex-offender registration, which would have done him permanent harm.

There are some real predators out there, and I understand the threats that make something like a registry necessary. However it has become a tool of the plea-deal legal industry and a mechanism by which non-predatory individuals have had their lives ruined by the state.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#16

Post by bambax » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:06 AM UTC

> Her friend, who had just given birth to a baby girl, had logged on to the Michigan Public Sex Offender Registry Web site to search for local predators.

"Sex-offender" registry is of course a total and complete abomination. But if you're going to write against it, maybe you owe it to yourself and your readers to not use the words of the enemy -- namely "predators".

There are no "predators". There may or may not be people who made a mistake earlier in life -- many of those mistakes would not even be frowned upon in many other parts of the world.

But to call people on a sex-offenders list "predators" is like calling everyone on a no-fly list "terrorists".

It's bigoted, it's despicable. And it's at least counter productive to use that word in an article that tries to fight the very principle of those lists.

Also, to continue on a related wording controversy that's really irritating, victims shouldn't be able to automatically call themselves "survivors". You're a survivor only if you narrowly escaped death. If your life was never at risk then you're not a survivor.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#17

Post by bambax » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:11 AM UTC

sersi wrote: post #12

In the fight against the great boogeymen of Terrorism and Sex Predation, the US has lost common sense. As a kid, when I was 8 years old, I played doctor with my neighbor, we we were both curious about each others differences and so we explored them. So, if I read this article, if this had been in the US, we could have been tried as sex offenders? How does this even make sense? Of course kids are curious about body di…

> It's really scary how easily it is to pass Orwellian by invoking "Think of the Children" or "To prevent terrorists".

The goal is not to fight so-called sex-crimes or terrorism. The goal is to

1. coerce people into behaving in an ideal way where sexuality is constrained and nothing happens

2. discriminate against minorities

using big words and supposed "victims" as tools and props.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#18

Post by golergka » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:18 AM UTC

bambax wrote: post #17

sersi wrote: post #12

In the fight against the great boogeymen of Terrorism and Sex Predation, the US has lost common sense. As a kid, when I was 8 years old, I played doctor with my neighbor, we we were both curious about each others differences and so we explored them. So, if I read this article, if this had been in the US, we could have been tried as sex offenders? How does this even make sense? Of course kids are curious about body di…

> It's really scary how easily it is to pass Orwellian by invoking "Think of the Children" or "To prevent terrorists". The goal is not to fight so-called sex-crimes or terrorism. The goal is to 1. coerce people into behaving in an ideal way where sexuality is constrained and nothing happens 2. discriminate against minorities using big words and supposed "victims" as tools and props.

Just to clarify: do you think that this is being put through intentionally by people who're organized together with hidden evil plan?

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#19

Post by sgift » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:20 AM UTC

lb1lf wrote: post #9

gigatexal wrote: post #4

Well if the predilection towards pedophilia could be managed or "cured" and if prisons did more than just house inmates I.e if they worked on rehab instead of punishment then perhaps the lifetime listings wouldn't be necessary. I won't begin to insinuate that I have the right balance between parents wanting to be cautious with who their kids interact with and the belief that people can change for the better. And then…

This. In Norway (heck, in Scandinavia, and, is my impression, in most of North/Central Europe, too), there's strong focus on rehabilitation. Inmates are encouraged to pursue education while incarcerated. If you want to enter a trade, there are workshops &c in the prisons where you can do your apprenticeship. Also, in all but the (rare) cases where you are deemed to be a lasting danger to society, you are automaticall…

> That being said, liberal me still feel somewhat less lenient towards paedophiles; I guess any parent does.

It's a sickness. And we have (mental) hospitals for sick people. Problem solved, no leniency required.

Re: The sex-offender registry can be a life sentence

#20

Post by forvelin » Mon, Mar 20, 2017, 10:23 AM UTC

buro9 wrote: post #10

From everything I've ever read, there is no concept of rehabilitation in the USA. If you have ever been convicted, or even accused, of a felony or sexual crime in the USA then life as you knew it was over. The concept of being able to pay a debt to society and for that to settle the books, and to then allow those people to return to society and contribute value again... is alien to America. The problem starts with th…

Is this related to fact that there are people who profit over correction services in United States ? After digging around VICE article[0], lack of rehab in US made bit sense at least.

[0] - https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/whos-getting-rich-off-the...