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OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

open-emr.org

111–120 of 214 posts

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#111
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think we will ever see HL7 messages exchanged between organizations. Each product has it's own list of message types that they support, and even then they will vary in terms of which segments have data and in some cases, even what that data will be. Patient identifiers also vary between organizations, making it hard to know which patient goes with which piece of data. Alternative methods for passing data betw…

You haven't been paying attention. I've been working on products which exchange HL7 messages between organizations for 20 years. It's very common now. Some configuration work is usually needed on each interface but that's mostly a solved problem.

I think he likely meant "I don't think we will ever see HL7 messages exchanged between organizations [routinely and with little effort]."

"some configuration work is usually needed on each interface" is the key phrase in your response. Just because many organizations have poured cash into yours and your competitors' solutions when the economic stars align does not mean that message passing between organizations is a solved problem.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#112

I'm currently working on my thesis, I'm trying to design a radically different take on EMR/EHR systems - http://barnett.surge.sh/ I've come to realize healthcare software is a significantly trickier problem than most realize. Not in terms of technical possiblity, but other factors. Building healthcare software is really hard - which seems like such a paradox, because surely ensuring highly trained individuals have ha…

There's also some structural reasons. Why is it that larger practices don't write their own software? Well, maybe a few do, but:

a) nearly all states require that ownership in medical practice be restricted to those licensed to practice. This reduces access to capital, and more or less ensures that practices remain small businesses. b) nearly all care in the US is fragmented across specialists in different practices. c) healthcare in the US is largely paid for by parties fairly disinterested in actually transacting. While most folks on HN might A/B test UI improvements looking at click through rates, the implicit idea in insurance billing software is that submitting claims is someone else's expense to deal with.

When you look at places where there is a scale to medical practice, opportunity for software opens up. VA and DoD both operate and staff their own health care facilities, and have software systems they've implemented. But even DoD has problems receiving and retaining records from outside care providers (if Wikipedia is to be believed).

If there were fewer, larger medical practices in the US, it would both be easier to agree on standardized data sharing protocols, and more likely for patients to see multiple doctors working for the same employer, thus never necessitating a data transfer. Admittedly, it'd be harder entrepreneurs like yourself to break in. Perhaps you'd be an employee or Engineering manager working on the problem instead. Or perhaps you'd be selling a plugin to a larger EMR.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#113
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I can tell, there's no economic incentive for health care systems to undergo these transformations willingly. Remember, the digital transformation didn't occur until the HITECH act in 2009, which mandated the use of electronic health records. Why digitize your operations and worry about maintaining tech infrastructure when you can do everything on paper with a handful of secretaries? You could argue providi…

I don't see why any physician implements an EMR. My family doctor, who was part of a midsize practice was punished hard by adopting a system. They did it in 2007 thinking they would save money... which didn't happen as they were only able to eliminate 1/4 clerk positions and had to pick up an IT guy and a consultant. Then they really got the shaft when the solution they chose wasn't meeting Medicare guidelines. They…

I saw one system that seemed like a must have: apps that ensure you got the prescription right. Paper-loving doctors screwing up prescriptions harms a lot of patients. Especially when they insist on writing in cursive.

Much of your post seems to be about bad tech, though. It could mostly be mitigated with a supplier that gave a shit.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, but that sector is so heavily regulated that it scares off startups, and who can blame them.

You might be interested in athenahealth, a Web-oriented healthcare company which actually runs a sort of startup incubator ("More Disruption, Please"), and has led a lot of initiatives to improve interoperability. They realize these things create trouble for them as well as the rest of the field, but I think they're betting that their rivals are significantly less flexible than they are. (This is a safe bet, of cours…

Slightly OT: I read somewhere that whenever you see "to disrupt" you should replace it with "to fuck up" as that is the true meaning of what is being said. Not that it's always a bad thing, but it is almost always destructive.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#115
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google actually gave it a shot, and then eventually gave up. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Health

That sounds more like a patient portal used by patients. Building something for physicians, nurses, revenue personnel, lab personnel, and practice managers is a completely different game.

I think the idea they were going for is that Google Health would be an EMR intended to be used by institutions except that the patient is in control of their record - enabling them to take their health record to any provider. The problem is that institutions have close to no reasons for investing into something like that.

I think Microsoft HealthVault was more of what you describe, where it's a portal intended to be used by patients.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#116
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google actually gave it a shot, and then eventually gave up. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Health

That sounds more like a patient portal used by patients. Building something for physicians, nurses, revenue personnel, lab personnel, and practice managers is a completely different game.

It turns out re. docs and nurses, not really. It's important to understand the who pays for what in healthcare, and how many links in the chain exist between payer, payee and who benefits. Physicians and nurses are not able to pick whatever software they want to view patient data because 1.) you need high security all around that data, and 2.) that data is primarily useful to someone else. It's useful to the doctor because they want to treat the patient. It's a lot more useful to the hospital because they want to get paid for what was done.

So the hospital is willing to shell out a ton of cash so that they have a Very Secure system that helps them better manage their cash flow. If you walk in as a doc with (for example) a nifty phone app that lets you track your patients in real time, you'll confront 2 problems: 1.) the hospital won't let you connect because it'll assume (possibly incorrectly) that it's a huge security hole. 2.) even if they did let you connect, their EMR is non-standard (basically all of them end up non-standard) and there's no lingua franca protocol for medical data, so your app is incompatible.

It's really really tricky to solve all those issues AND have it be cheap enough for a doc to be willing to shell out for it out of pocket. I personally you'd need that kind of consumer-side scale to get enough competition to get medical software to innovate more quickly. I will say a common interchange format would help a lot, that's one of the objectives FHIR had, and the industry has been slowly adopting it.

You accurately point out revenue personnel and practice managers as key players here, and yes they're the ones that usually push EMRs etc. But the front line workers are kind of disconnected from the design and functionality of the EMR.

Put another way you have software that's bought by one person (hospital/provider), it's used to collect data by a totally different person with different needs (docs/nurses), and it's paid for eventually by another person who has no idea how it works nor any direct pressing need for it (patient/but let's be real, insurance company/government).

Without a tight connection between who pays for the software, who uses the software and who benefits from the software (most consumer software is a pretty tight loop), it's hard to have a good virtuous cycle of innovation coming from customer/user insight/observation/needs.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#117

EMR is simply too messy for openEMR to put a dent in the issue. I truely wish it were different. If insurance carriers are permitted to operate across state lines in the future, i think there is a chance of a Google or Microsoft getting into the space which I think is the right way to go. Right now, the large companies managing EMR and huge monoliths that simply don't care about innovation. They are like defense cont…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Health They did try actually

They aren't even the only ones who moved into the EHR space, discovered that it's a nightmare, and moved back out. GE bought one of the smaller "big ten" vendors (IDX) in the late 2000s, then gave up and spun off the formerly-IDX EHR; even Siemens came, saw, and left.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#118
post #52
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But most physicians don't work for hospitals. They work at small practices with 10 physicians or fewer (according to the AMA). There was a completely open market, made of the majority of physicians, regardless of existing provider contracts with hospitals. I know I talked to a few physicians (and other healthcare professionals) in the mid-2000s who lamented the paperwork they had to do every day and the lack of avail…

The issue with small practices and even slightly larger physician's groups is that an EMR is often just a cost, with very little benefit. If you're a hospital with lab facilities, imaging facilities, surgical facilities etc. it's hugely useful to have medical records flow internally (quasi-)seamlessly. The EMR does that well, and the large cost of typing things into the EMR (it's slow, painful, annoying, never met a…

So I am a physician with a large hospital system that uses Epic. I think your comments about poor communication (btw Epic systems) are outdated. For the last two years when I admit a patient I can easily access all Epic records not only in other hospitals in my state, but in the country through their system labeled "CareEverywhere". It is a game changer and is really the main reason why I rank Epic above other EMRs I've used.

Re: OpenEMR: Electronic Medical Records and Medical Practice Management Software

#120

Is it easy to use? Does it reduce the amount of paperwork to be done? How safe is it?

I think it is easy to use, and yes it has the potential to nearly (if not completely) eliminate all paperwork in your clinic.

As far as safety, openEMR is fully HIPPA compliant as well as 2014 ONC Complete Ambulatory EHR certified (a/k/a Meaningful Use 2).

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