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Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

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Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#71

Post by troystribling »

Groxx wrote: post #59
raphar wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It interesting view this google vs apple in: http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:AAPL+goog put the graph to 1y or 5y.

Interesting in the similarities? Compare it with Microsoft (MSFT), the ups and downs appear to be more due to economic shifts than any connection between the two. AAPL/GOOG is definitely closer than AAPL/MSFT, but part of that could simply be due to that both are growing and changing quickly, and are less immune to economic forces than entrenched-MSFT.

GOOG is now selling at about its mid 2005 price while APPL is about 350% above its mid 2005 price.

Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#72

Post by hugh3 »

evo_9 wrote: post #55
jacquesm wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a GBox has a nice ring to it actually. Let's not go there ok ?

The reality is we are going there because Google (along with Apple) are both developing 'connected tv's (aka, wifi enabled, OS running tv's). Not exactly an attempt to go right at Sony, Nintendo, etc, but Apple has shown how disruptive a sideways entry into a new market can be (or was that more of a happy accident stumble sideways?). Plus, I think the 'game companies' fail to recognize what a huge market casual games…

That seems like the sort of market that google is going to win. Apple is going to want to sell you an Apple-branded piece of hardware (either a TV or a box) that lets your TV do new things. Google will simply license their technology to Samsung, LG, Panasonic and all the other existing TV manufacturers and have it built in to every TV that gets shipped.

(Except maybe Sony, who will probably attempt to build their own system. It won't work very well outside Japan.)

Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#74

Post by buster »

rimantas wrote: post #68
buster wrote: post #61

wow.. 25$ a share for MS vs. 250$ for Apple? As much as i like that Apple innovates and does produce good products, you'll have to be blind to not see the share crash in the future.. it strongly reminds me of the old startup days.. I mean (not offending) MS products are deployed in what.. 95% of all computers? office in every companies PC? Windows? Ok, Apple does have music selling through itunes, hardware (very low…

Ok, Apple does have music selling through itunes, hardware (very low market share here!) and the mobile app sales. You should research what share of profits they have with that very low market share in both computers and smartphones markets.

Computers? As in Desktop computers and laptops worldwide? I can't find current numbers but i wouldn't think that Apple has reached a global market share for desktops over 10%. Take a look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_system... Thats what i meant. Now tell me that in _this_ area Apple is exactly worth as much as MS. MS doesn't produce computers, so the comparison is not fair. But that's why i said i would want to see the numbers for all the departments of MS and Apple.

Also, the global market share for smart phones: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smartphone

You surely don't want to know the numbers for mobile phones in general.

Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#75

Post by hugh3 »

herdrick wrote: post #43

So, when did Microsoft surpass Apple in market cap? 1992? 1988?

Good question. I couldn't find out since I can't get either google finance or yahoo finance to plot market cap, but I did get this:

http://ycharts.com/search?q=MSFT%20vs%20AAPL&c=market_ca...

It only goes back ten years but it at least shows that MSFT was vastly bigger than AAPL back in 1999.

Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#76

Post by Jun8 »

Jun8 wrote: post #5
melling wrote: post #2

Some would argue that they were always worth more. :-) It's interesting that this happened without breaking Microsoft's 90% desktop monopoly. Apple got bigger but it wasn't to the detriment of Microsoft. They just grew into new markets.

Exactly! One of the best essay in PG's H&Ps book in my opinion was the one that explains how winning doesn't have to be a zero-sum game, you can generate wealth. This seems a no brainer but a lot of people don't get it. Many predict that a similar thing will happen in the battle between Google and Apple.

Forgot to put a link to the essay, here it is: http://www.paulgraham.com/wealth.html

Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#77

Post by ssp »

louislouis wrote: post #70

If APPL, MSFT or GOOG disappeared tomorrow. Which one would cause the least damage? Which one could we live without?

Would everything they ever made disappear too? If so, the loss of Windows and Office would create much more chaos than the loss of Google. The disappearance of all Apple products would not cause that much damage in comparison.

Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#79

Post by zmitri »

ergo98 wrote: post #45
zmitri wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just so you know, Goldman Sachs' P/E has nothing to do with this discussion. GS is a player in an entirely different industry and it is useless to compare this one statistic between two tech companies.

>Goldman Sachs' P/E has nothing to do with this discussion Nothing? Don't you think that's a little strong? P/E reflects growth prospects, and a large, established financial company has limited growth prospects. Just as a large, established, coasting tech company tends to have lower P/E ratios. GS lives in an industry with lower P/E ratios, but saying that it has "nothing" to do with it is terribly wrong.

I am in the midst of studying for a hefty financial certification exam right, so your comment reminded of something that is frowned upon in the financial industry.

Its not that what you're saying is completely wrong, just unnecessary.

A P/E ratio is useful, but it requires lots of context. You provided no context and mentioned a stock that shows little to no correlation to the tech industry and plus the financial industry is somewhat "messy" right now.

I suggest you look up some other large established banks and their P/E ratios right now. For example, Morgan Stanley (MS) has a P/E of 98. Does that mean they have that much more growth potential? Maybe it means that GS is currently undervalued with all the negative press they are getting recently? A low P/E could also be a sign of being undervalued, just as a high P/E can a sign of being overvalued. On the other hand, the tech industry is proving to be quite lucrative lately. Apple has released the iPad and is coming up on their WWDC and there is plenty of speculation concerning iPhone 4G and mobile advertising opportunities. With all the media attention Apple gets, their "friendly" design, and their phenomenal advertising campaigns, isn't it quite possible that they are overvalued? As soon as a viable Windows 7 based tablet comes out that lets you torrent, play divx via divxplayer and flash, don't you think the iPad might be a little more than fucked in its current incarnation/closed environment? And who knows, maybe Microsoft is undervalued right now seeing as two execs have left? Its at a fairly low share price (historically speaking) right now.

tl;dr Fundamental analysis is complicated enough as it is, don't throw in unrelated numbers.

Re: Apple is Officially Worth More than Microsoft

#80

Post by megablast »

buster wrote: post #74
rimantas wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, Apple does have music selling through itunes, hardware (very low market share here!) and the mobile app sales. You should research what share of profits they have with that very low market share in both computers and smartphones markets.

Computers? As in Desktop computers and laptops worldwide? I can't find current numbers but i wouldn't think that Apple has reached a global market share for desktops over 10%. Take a look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_system... Thats what i meant. Now tell me that in _this_ area Apple is exactly worth as much as MS. MS doesn't produce computers, so the comparison is not fair. But that's why…

Wow, you are quick. He said profit, not market share. For example, Apple maybe only sell 2-3% of the entire mobile handset market, but make more profit out of any Mobile company. They make more money than Nokia, who sell 100x as many phones.
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