We added tolls to London but traffic hasn't got any better
To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
81–90 of 689 posts
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#82Earlier quoted context omitted.
> rather than wait for a stranger to pick them in a semi-determined block of time I think the idea is that it's supposed to match you in real-time and give GPS updates, just like regular Uber and Lyft. That is, it's not like BlancRide in Canada (which has been struggling) where you schedule in advance, have blocks of time, etc. https://blancride.com/ > Waiting and hoping that the person who promised to pick you up wi…
What's the incentive for people to be the driver in this scenario, other than not crapping up the commons (which in this case is the freeway?)
They get paid.
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#83The problem as I see it is that we force everyone onto the freeway. Need to get somewhere a few miles from here? They make it very difficult to get there without getting onto the freeway. There was some point in the last 30 years where city designers decided the best way to handle local traffic was just to force everyone onto the freeway. It's horrible. There should instead be a reasonable main grid of smaller (2 lan…
Waze will get you anywhere in LA without a freeway.
Once you learn the side streets, there's always a faster way when the freeway is backed up.
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#84What about the poor? LA for most parts, against popular belief, is a pretty homogenous city when it comes to wealth, sure you have Beverly Hills and Malibu but LA is so vast that majority of it doesn't feel secluded. Now if you toll the non-wealthy (the rich will not notice the toll) you remove that dynamic, that headline should really say let's remove more poor people from the freeways.
With any Pigouvian tax[1] you encounter the problem of progressivity. The answer is to make sure that the tax revenues are directed towards making it easier for low income people to have better transit options. Whether that means improved transit systems or income based toll exceptions, it's relatively easy to offset the detrimental impacts that tolling may put in place. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pigovian_tax
I just think A) we have to be honest that is only a tax on the poor B) then have the rich pay in a different way, maybe it should be a limit on duration of travel or miles by humans, ie. no matter what car you drive or who drives you you're not allowed to travel more than x number of miles/day. (this is beginning to sound really odd)
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#85> The reason that electrical power and air travel don’t fail every time they get crowded is that we raise prices to manage demand. Air travel and electrical power: (1) Are easier to add capacity for during times of peak demand (2) Actually do fail (even though tolled!) when demand exceeds capacity (brown/blackouts for electrical power, cascading delays easily exceeding those for ground traffic when weather knocks dow…
People do know that it costs to drive a car but the cost is hidden in some sense. I think few people actually calculate how much driving really costs. When I drive 10 miles I don't think to myself that it's going to cost me $5.40 (using IRS mileage rate). Gasoline taxes do not come close to paying for the road system. I remember when gas hit around $5 a gallon in the U.S. some years ago people did think about driving cost a lot more.
I suspect if the costs were more apparent people would be more apt to support public transportation and reconsider their driving habits.
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#86Miami tried this, made tolls $7+, it did nothing. And because they put up barriers between the express (toll) lanes and regular lanes, when someone got in an accident in the express lanes, it was FAR slower than the regular lane. The mentality was/is '$7, well its worth it because I can't sit in traffic'
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#87Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe we should also consider the concept of mass transit? The increased likelihood of injury or death from increased transit time in automobiles alone is a health hazard.
LA is getting better with mass transit. The problem is it's not running 24 hours. It shuts down around 1am so you it's not really good for doing things at night like in NYC. Also, there's a TON of crazy people riding, literal homeless crazy people, or kind of thuggish people. There needs to be some sort of loitering code enforcement on the train along with more security. I feel uncomfortable as a dude, I bet women fe…
Better enforcement is a good idea. Seems to be worth the money.
Or carry concealed permits. You'll have to repeal California's action that requires all new semi-auto's to have a unique firing pin. But then you don't have to worry traveling.
I carry. I keep odd hours in a small town. I walk every night .25 miles to my office at 8 PM and then back again around 2 AM. Never had any problem (probably the same as most people on the train). If I do, I've got protection.
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe we should also consider the concept of mass transit? The increased likelihood of injury or death from increased transit time in automobiles alone is a health hazard.
I'm certainly not writing mass transit off but I've simply never seen it work in practice. I know that my 7 minute commute is well over an hour by bus. I'd rather just pay the aforementioned tolls than waste 2 hours of my day on a bus, every day. That would add up to years of my life wasted pretty quickly. I'm far more hopeful for self driving cars than mass transit.
Self-driving cars are, unfortunately, an expensive half-assed solution to transportation in the US.
Buses (And really, any at-grade transportation that has to share the road with cars) are, unfortunately, not mass transit. 7 minutes vs an hour sounds atrocious.
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#89The problem as I see it is that we force everyone onto the freeway. Need to get somewhere a few miles from here? They make it very difficult to get there without getting onto the freeway. There was some point in the last 30 years where city designers decided the best way to handle local traffic was just to force everyone onto the freeway. It's horrible. There should instead be a reasonable main grid of smaller (2 lan…
Elon Musk: “Without tunnels, we will all be in traffic hell forever. I really do think tunnels are the key to solving urban gridlock. Being stuck in traffic is soul-destroying. Self-driving cars will actually make it worse by making vehicle travel more affordable".
http://www.theverge.com/2017/1/25/14391410/elon-musk-tunnels...
Re: To fix L.A.'s traffic, we need tolls
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. You are thinking about it wrong. By making it cost prohibitive for the poors to move around we will be able to concentrate their populations into designated "bottom feeder" neighborhoods allowing us to more effectively rob them of basic public services like education, healthcare, and potable water.
> By making it cost prohibitive for the poors to move around Am I the only person who found the phrase 'the poors' offensive? I'm genuinely asking.
Is that the only thing you found offensive about that comment?
Poe's law appears to be in effect here.