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Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

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Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#41
post #16

I own an Echo and this is part of the reason it now sits unplugged. To be honest, it doesn't provide enough value for me to consider potentially compromising the privacy of my home.

Without trying being rude, surely this was obvious before you purchased it?

Also, your phone is probably already listening to you - and maybe your cable box.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#42
post #16

I own an Echo and this is part of the reason it now sits unplugged. To be honest, it doesn't provide enough value for me to consider potentially compromising the privacy of my home.

Mentioned this in another comment, but they can only reveal voice data IF the victim said "Alexa" when the crime was taking place. If the victim didn't say "Alexa" that day, then there's nothing to reveal.

At least in our office it happens quite commonly that Alexa will trigger on phrases that aren't the word "Alexa" and are even unrelated to it.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#43
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But how long before lack of consent is considered incriminating? There are also many different jurisdictions which don't have 5th amendment style protections.

It will be a long time in the jurisdiction of this case before constitutional protection against self-incrimination is stripped.

That protection has mostly gotten stronger over the past 200+ years, so I think you're probably right.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#44
post #3

This should be a lesson to people who don't understand the distinction between "can't" and "won't". If you're running things yourself and control the encryption keys required to access your data, then your service provider can't be compelled to release your data as it's not possible[1][2]. If you're delegating all of that to your service provider and they have access to the raw data, then you are putting all your tru…

Makes me think in future cases when someone says in court "I do not recall", we are going to see Google Home / Echo data being called into play. As someone with 3 google home devices in the house, I feel like my feara I've been suppressing are all coming true.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feels a bit weird. Why does a defendant consenting change anything? Presumably if they were asleep as claimed, they're basically consenting to something that's unrelated to themselves.

That was my first thought. Why should the defendant have a say in what evidence can be collected? Did the Feds ask if they could take DNA samples from the scene, for example?

In this case, the defendant may have a say only because Amazon is claiming there is standing to enforce the defendant's First Amendment rights - the so-called chilling effect.

With the defendant consenting, Amazon's standing for litigating this issue becomes more fraught.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#46
post #3

This should be a lesson to people who don't understand the distinction between "can't" and "won't". If you're running things yourself and control the encryption keys required to access your data, then your service provider can't be compelled to release your data as it's not possible[1][2]. If you're delegating all of that to your service provider and they have access to the raw data, then you are putting all your tru…

They can only reveal voice data IF the victim said "Alexa" when the crime was taking place. If the victim didn't say "Alexa" that day, then there's nothing to reveal. Your example about encryption doesn't make sense in the context of the Echo.

I'm not certain there exists nothing to reveal. Is there a technical limitation of the system that prevents or avoids recording of "non-'Alexa'" audio? Or do I just trust Amazon when they say their alway-on device only records when triggered with the magic word?

As I think about it, I'd ask the same regarding the voice-controllable phone in my pocket.

FWIW, I don't trust the devices, because their operations are out of any consumer's ability to control them, but maybe I'm missing something about their technical limitations that would work in my favor.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#47
This is a non-issue. The audio Amazon receives is from only-just-barely-before the wakeword up to and through the command or timeout expiration. Yes, it's possible that the defendants cat meowed right before the murder and it sounded like "Alexa". But it seems incredibly unlikely.

Prosecutors are just trying to cover every base but the likelihood that this will yield anything is very low.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#48
post #16

I own an Echo and this is part of the reason it now sits unplugged. To be honest, it doesn't provide enough value for me to consider potentially compromising the privacy of my home.

The person consented. Amazon did not hand it over before then.

Re: Amazon to hand over Echo audio from alleged murder after defendant consents

#50
post #16

I own an Echo and this is part of the reason it now sits unplugged. To be honest, it doesn't provide enough value for me to consider potentially compromising the privacy of my home.

If people are getting murdered in your home and the cops catch wind of it, your privacy will be compromised whether or not you have an Echo.
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