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The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

kukuruku.co

261–270 of 616 posts

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#261

That was a sad thing to read, the author is so clueless they don't even know when the reasons they imagine something might have been broken are wrong. Back when UNIX was born the character was a first class citizen in every computer on the planet, and many languages used it as part of their syntax. Static binaries were invented when Sun and Berkeley co-developed shared libraries and there needed to be binaries that y…

Not just tab, but Vertical-Tab.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#262
post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All the fasteners I have seen are standard metric sizes, what speciality tools are you referring to? The side cover screws can be stubborn but even a Philips #3 with an impact driver ($20.00 at the pawn shop) pops them right off. Conversion kits to standard allen head screws are cheap, on the order of $50.00 for the whole engine. There is a special nut on the oil spinner but that's the only specialty tool I can think…

did you have fun converting JIS to metric? I learned that one the hard way. Three EZ-Outs later...

That's what the impact driver is for. I didn't have to convert any bolts to metric, all those are already metric. Only the screws need to be converted.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#263
post #125
post #14

This article was written hastily, and I don’t want to further improve it. You’re lucky I wrote it. I feel so privileged to read this random guy's blog, and it's terrific that he eschews inflating his ego so well.

As an hobbyist blogger, I can perfectly empathise with why the author wrote that. People love to crap all over a blogger who dares to post his thoughts on a private blog, without first subjecting it to PhD-thesis-level scrutiny. This really gets on my nerves for the same reasons that engineers get pissed off when they decide to open source a pet project and suddenly start getting "URGENT ASAP" feature requests from e…

I'd have much more respect for him if he wrote an entire article about this and explaining his position than prefacing an otherwise unrelated article with his frustrations. I'm not lucky he wrote it. From my perspective he wasted his time writing it, because I don't care enough to read past the first paragraph.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#264
post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Inertia is only proof of inertia.

Suggesting that Unix has been continuing just by inertia doesn't explain why Apple adopted Unix for macOS or why most newer computers nowadays run a Unix OS.

I suggested nothing of the sort. I am criticizing your use of "still going strong" as proof of good design. And there are many possible explanations of why Apple adopted Unix. Inertia is certainly one of them! (If you want to write a new operating system, and all your programmers are familiar with unix, and you don't have enough money to start from scratch... you start from unix)

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#265
post #49

"We really are using a 1970s era operating system well past its sell-by date. We get a lot done, and we have fun, but let's face it, the fundamental design of Unix is older than many of the readers of Slashdot, while lots of different, great ideas about computing and networks have been developed in the last 30 years. Using Unix is the computing equivalent of listening only to music by David Cassidy." Rob Pike 2004, h…

He said that because back then he was working on a new OS. This was PR.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#266
post #49

"We really are using a 1970s era operating system well past its sell-by date. We get a lot done, and we have fun, but let's face it, the fundamental design of Unix is older than many of the readers of Slashdot, while lots of different, great ideas about computing and networks have been developed in the last 30 years. Using Unix is the computing equivalent of listening only to music by David Cassidy." Rob Pike 2004, h…

He said that because back ten he was working on a new OS. This was PR.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#267
post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maintenance "headaches" are part of the appeal of old bikes. It's much easier to learn how an internal combustion powered vehicle works on an old Honda bike than a new one, or on a new car. Compared to other bikes of their day these are very simple to maintain and they were designed from the start to be kept running by the average person. It really depends on what you are looking for in a bike. If enjoying turning a…

There is weekend wrenching and there is dealing with design flaws and poor manufacturing. Problems with the CB175 and CB550 that were not regular maintenance (carburetor/timing/valve/etc/etc) related: * fast cylinder wear (poor materials/manufacturing, engine rebuilds all around) * unreliable electric system ("mostly" fixed on CB550 with Charlie's solid state ignition and rectifier) * Leaking gaskets (design flaw) I…

What gaskets leaked? Side covers? I haven't had a problem with side cover gaskets but I did have some replacement non-JIS screws back out because they were not torqued properly. Can't speak to cylinder wear, my bike has close to 10k hard miles and doesn't compression test real well but does work fine.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#268
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an hobbyist blogger, I can perfectly empathise with why the author wrote that. People love to crap all over a blogger who dares to post his thoughts on a private blog, without first subjecting it to PhD-thesis-level scrutiny. This really gets on my nerves for the same reasons that engineers get pissed off when they decide to open source a pet project and suddenly start getting "URGENT ASAP" feature requests from e…

I respectfully disagree with that last part. IMO it's your moral obligation as a distributor of information to, to the best of your ability, ensure its' truth and validity. I'm not saying it has to be PhD-thesis-level, but if proven wrong you are morally obligated to update the information or remove it. Otherwise you are spreading false knowledge. This doesn't apply to opinions ofc (the bulk of private blogging). Scr…

Nothing can really be trusted without judgement, and as long it's not claiming to be an authoritative source about a life and death situation, I wouldn't want to put the bar as high as an obligation.

After 20+ years of working in the business and reading ridiculous amounts of articles, and some books, I can quite easily find clear errors or omissions in most everything written about computers and programming, Knuth excluded. If everyone were obliged to update to fix any errors, even only factual, it's likely that much - or even most - of all I've read would never have been posted for me to read in the first place, and I think both the world and I would be poorer for it.

Correctness is important, but so is the ability make judgments of validity, to critique, disseminate, inspire and express ones thoughts, even when they turn out to be wrong.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#269
post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Contrary to your beliefs, one can have both self-respect and a sense of humor.

It's hard to believe this came from a place of humor after reading the otherwise dry article.

It's your prerogative to follow trends to determine what you find worthy of your time or not, but it's not a good thing to suggest that anyone that tolerates that type of language better than you do or even enjoys it, lacks self respect.

A lot of people find that cockiness funny and find the informality welcoming. And many of those tend to find cold formality, fake humility or lack of self-confidence as signs of something being boring, uninteresting or outright creepy.

EDIT: Comment was edited, original:

  It's hard to believe this came from a place of humor after reading the otherwise dry article. The article was otherwise fairly interesting, but that certainly left a sour taste in my mouth. He's lucky I read past the first paragraph, if it wasn't so prominent on HN I probably wouldn't have bothered listening to anything he had to say.

Re: The Collapse of the Unix Philosophy

#270

That was a sad thing to read, the author is so clueless they don't even know when the reasons they imagine something might have been broken are wrong. Back when UNIX was born the character was a first class citizen in every computer on the planet, and many languages used it as part of their syntax. Static binaries were invented when Sun and Berkeley co-developed shared libraries and there needed to be binaries that y…

I had much the same reaction. I learned Unix on a PDP-11 running sixth edition AT&T. I was also using the University's UNIVAC 1108 and the elegance, simplicity and orthogonality of the Shell vs the EXEC-8 command language was a joy to behold. Sure, there is much about Unix that could be better and I sometimes regret that Plan 9 didn't succeed more. But it's like Kirk said to Saavik, "You have to learn WHY things work…

I wrote my own version of Make for VAX/VMS and MSDOS, back in 1983 or so. I hated the tab mechanism of the Unix make, so I didn't use it, and none of my users (of which there were apparently thousands) ever complained. I got a few "thank you"s for it.

TAB was a stupid choice even in the 1970s.

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