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Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

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Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#121

Post by prodmerc »

PastaMonster wrote: post #72
beambot wrote: post #22

Surprising that big pharma is an opponent to a readily-available natural substance outside the purview of patent protections. Quick, better enforce the federal ban.

Been asking myself why drugs that make you feel good is banned like cannabis, mushrooms, LSD, etc. Government got anything against people feeling good? Conspiracy?

Something about people not getting addicted and ruining their lives.

But then you see alcoholics, smokers with cancer, morbidly obese from food, stabbings... basically, follow the money to see why anything is banned, ever.

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#122

Post by cyphax »

jessep wrote: post #28

I get kidney stones pretty often (6 times in the last 8 years). I vomit from the pain, convulse on the floor, lose all sense of self as I just struggle to survive the sensation. It is intense. Usually I have to go to the emergency room for IV opioids. Then they give you some to take home after you pass the peak of the pain. Last time it happened to me, I went home at around 6pm after going into the hospital that morn…

> I cannot describe to you how much more effective it was than the opioids. The pain wasn't gone, but it was just an interesting sensation now

I had that experience too when I dropped something heavy on my toe, which sounds a lot funnier than it felt when the pressure under my toe went up (which I should have relieved by puncturing the nail, which I was not capable of doing to myself at that point)! But weed didn't make the pain go away, it just made it tolerable somehow. And I managed to puncture the nail after all. I also saw someone with chronic pain get prescribed oxycontin, which isn't only very addictive, it also didn't work for her the way weed did. And with the latter being not-so-addictive, it would only make sense to me to use it more often for pain relief. It can be such a relief for so many people.

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#123

Post by Y_Y »

developer2 wrote: post #38
sergers wrote: post #14

My mom has benefited from cannabis to help treat chrohns. While nothing has cured, it's been the most effective with no known side effects. Plus it's cheaper than the meds she has been buying for years (spending out of pocket upwards $10k a year with $500 a pill just for flare ups even with medicare in Canada). She has been in hell for 30 years. They wanted to remove her small intestine ~20 years ago and she didn't w…

Crohn's Disease is one of those things where, if you do not suffer from it personally, you have absolutely no business telling someone who does what they may or may not do to treat it - or rather its symptoms. I have a friend with Crohn's, and based on his reserved description (not far past PG-13) as to what he goes through on a daily basis, I would not DARE tell him that he cannot use marijuana, opioids, or anything…

> Nobody - absolutely nobody - has the right tell him differently. > People are ignorant and frankly downright... disgusting/pathetic/opinionated

Those are some very strong claims. You can be sympathetic without being hyperbolic, or assuming that the reason that other don't share your views is that they're bad people who don't share your perfect reasoning.

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#124

Post by Spooky23 »

jessep wrote: post #28

I get kidney stones pretty often (6 times in the last 8 years). I vomit from the pain, convulse on the floor, lose all sense of self as I just struggle to survive the sensation. It is intense. Usually I have to go to the emergency room for IV opioids. Then they give you some to take home after you pass the peak of the pain. Last time it happened to me, I went home at around 6pm after going into the hospital that morn…

It does seem bizarre.

My wife had an acute, severe medical issue that resulted in a hospital admission.

I don't know if cannabis would have been appropriate, but the heavy opiod doses given to her weren't exactly amazing at managing her pain, but their side effects were almost worse than the pain and likely extended her stay.

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#125

Post by spacemanmatt »

agumonkey wrote: post #69
doctorcroc wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You also incidentally hit upon the reason why it's been marginalized by industry for so long -- it represents a huge dent in profits. Whenever something seems awry, a good question to ask is, cui bono (who benefits)?

I understand the viewpoint; but what about a pragmatic peaceful solution: let the persons in need organize and spread the knowledge. We probably could setup an open statistical sufferers sharing platform to avoid rumor/placebo effects without resorting to trust a big industry.

Why can't we let people have freedom, but instead propose forcing sick people to mount a lobbying effort?

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#126

Post by rwmj »

poizan42 wrote: post #116
Accacin wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the problem? I'm completely for making all drug use legal but I don't want people driving when they've been taking drugs.

The testing doesn't show whether the person is currently under the influence - it tests for metabolites that can still be found a long time after use.

This isn't true. The tests and legal limits are all about delta9-THC, which disappears in a few hours. CBD and metabolites are not tested at all nor mentioned in the regulations.

Source: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2014/2868/pdfs/uksi_20142...

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#127

Post by kbart »

PastaMonster wrote: post #72
beambot wrote: post #22

Surprising that big pharma is an opponent to a readily-available natural substance outside the purview of patent protections. Quick, better enforce the federal ban.

Been asking myself why drugs that make you feel good is banned like cannabis, mushrooms, LSD, etc. Government got anything against people feeling good? Conspiracy?

Independent thinkers, open-minded people were always enemy of the state. Alcohol hampers your thought process and numbs you, but you can still labor the next day. Cannabis, mushrooms, LSD, on the other hand, broadens one's perspective and leads to more why? questions asked. See where it goes?

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#128

Post by vinceguidry »

SturgeonsLaw wrote: post #115
vidarh wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is also a new market for them. They can sit on their current market share or help open up a new market and risk it cannibalising their existing market while they potentially may fail to get sufficient market share in the new market to offset the losses. It seems like basically an industry on the defensive that see it as safer to just hole up and try to maintain status quo as much as possible.

Ah yes, the Blockbuster business model. Let's see how it goes for them.

I don't know why people attack Blockbuster's business model.

Blockbuster had a phenomenal business model, and effective leadership, that lasted 25 years and went through several re-conceptualizations. What happened to it wasn't a human failing.

The market simply got disrupted by Netflix. Businesses aren't people, they can't just turn the ship around at a moment's notice. What would you have had them do? Not have ever been in the video rental business in the first place and leave all that money on the table? Have the foresight to see Netflix coming?

I can understand why non-techies would use Blockbuster as a symbol for all things tech-disruption-related, but we can do a little better than that I hope.

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#129

Post by awestroke »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #114
benevol wrote: post #81

There are also other substances (such as psilocybin and LSD) which have the potential to massively reduce the cashflow of big pharma (specifically: in the case of anti-depressants). And now you understand the importance of the War on Drugs for billionaires in our society. It seems people are slowly beginning to understand to what degree our society and its systems are corrupted by "economic forces" and not built with…

I see people say this, and I disagree. And just for clarity, I'm definitely pro-drug legalisation - even of drugs I never want to be in the same room with. I think drug companies are precisely the sort of place to produce medical-grade LSD (and other therapudic "recreational" drugs) that has predictable dosages. Same goes for cannabinoids in pill form - especially the sorts meant for folks that would rather skip the…

LSD cannot be patented, so Big Pharma cannot make money on it - they'd have to compete on price, which would lead to really slim margins. If LSD is kept illegal, they can sell patented "alternatives" at huge margins.

Re: Given Choice, Patients Will Choose Cannabis Over Prescribed Opioids

#130

Post by smohare »

developer2 wrote: post #38
sergers wrote: post #14

My mom has benefited from cannabis to help treat chrohns. While nothing has cured, it's been the most effective with no known side effects. Plus it's cheaper than the meds she has been buying for years (spending out of pocket upwards $10k a year with $500 a pill just for flare ups even with medicare in Canada). She has been in hell for 30 years. They wanted to remove her small intestine ~20 years ago and she didn't w…

Crohn's Disease is one of those things where, if you do not suffer from it personally, you have absolutely no business telling someone who does what they may or may not do to treat it - or rather its symptoms. I have a friend with Crohn's, and based on his reserved description (not far past PG-13) as to what he goes through on a daily basis, I would not DARE tell him that he cannot use marijuana, opioids, or anything…

While I understand your sentiment, unmitigated access to treatment modalities is generally not a good thing. People, often children with no real informed consent, die every year because they forsake science-based medicine for quackery.

The efficacy and safety of a treatment are not something we want left to personal anecdote.

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