Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Strategic Consequences of Chinese Racism: Strategic Asymmetry for the USA (2013) [pdf]

gwern.net

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–75 of 75 posts

Re: Strategic Consequences of Chinese Racism: Strategic Asymmetry for the USA (2013) [pdf]

#71

Post by Redditshill »

hneans wrote: post #36
Redditshill wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my comments earlier in the thread it's pretty clear that I understand why many Chinese have the viewpoint that outside influence is bad. However, I think your viewpoint is way too extreme. China isn't some passive country now that is just sitting around being attacked by extremists/freedom fighters, but China is actively making aggressive moves towards many other countries. For example, China has threatened Taiw…

yes, my viewpoint is way too extreme, I just comment about Westerners' hypocrisy as the way some of Westerners did to China people. Threantened Taiwan? lol, Please find out the economic data of China-Taiwan trade, China maintains trade deficit with Taiwan, but maintains trade surplus for most countries, including the United States, Japan, and EU. And I hope you can figure out how the Taiwanese are treated in mainland…

I'm not sure how you define threaten, but I think that firing missiles over the island during election season (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Taiwan_Strait_Crisis) definitely counts as a threatening act. China has made so many threats about taking back Taiwan by force that I don't know how anybody could miss it. It's one thing to think that ROC is part of PRC (it's not), but it's another level of stubbornness to think that Taiwan is not threatened by Mainland China.

Re: Strategic Consequences of Chinese Racism: Strategic Asymmetry for the USA (2013) [pdf]

#72

Post by hneans »

Redditshill wrote: post #70
jff wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taiwan is the home of the legitimate government of mainland China. Taiwan #1.

Exactly -- any claim that mainland China (PRC) has over Taiwan (ROC), Taiwan could make that same claim over China. We don't see the US making a claim that UK is part of the US, it's simply ridiculous.

Yes, I do see The North threatened The South, and INVADED the South.

Re: Strategic Consequences of Chinese Racism: Strategic Asymmetry for the USA (2013) [pdf]

#73

Post by hneans »

Redditshill wrote: post #71
hneans wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, my viewpoint is way too extreme, I just comment about Westerners' hypocrisy as the way some of Westerners did to China people. Threantened Taiwan? lol, Please find out the economic data of China-Taiwan trade, China maintains trade deficit with Taiwan, but maintains trade surplus for most countries, including the United States, Japan, and EU. And I hope you can figure out how the Taiwanese are treated in mainland…

I'm not sure how you define threaten, but I think that firing missiles over the island during election season ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Taiwan_Strait_Crisis ) definitely counts as a threatening act. China has made so many threats about taking back Taiwan by force that I don't know how anybody could miss it. It's one thing to think that ROC is part of PRC (it's not), but it's another level of stubbornness…

lol, You think the missiles are aimed at Taiwan, so it is. Interesting. Have mainland boarded the island of Taiwan？ NO. Have the North invade The South? Yes.

Re: Strategic Consequences of Chinese Racism: Strategic Asymmetry for the USA (2013) [pdf]

#74

Post by throwaway729 »

yosefk wrote: post #65
throwaway729 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I know very little about China, but the report mentions in passing that racism is pervasive in Russia where I was born, whereas Western societies have done a remarkable job addressing racism. I don't think that the report is saying "China is racist and we aren't." It's saying that the difference between the US and China is that the US struggles with its racism whereas China doesn't. Or, at the very least, that this…

> They have no qualms with racism -- only with racism against Han Chinese. > Affirmative Action is somewhere near the mid-bottom, not the top, of a long list of very serious problems deeply rooted in racism. To you the fact that there are still black people who lived through Jim Crow matters more than the fact that there are Asians today who are turned down by high education institutions because of their race. Why ca…

> To you the fact that there are still black people who lived through Jim Crow matters more than the fact that there are Asians today who are turned down by high education institutions because of their race.

Yes. Absolutely.

The structural effects of 200 years of overtly racialized legal frameworks did not magically disappear with Brown v. Board. To claim that Jim Crow doesn't reverberate today in very concrete ways for millions of minorities in the US is ignorant beyond reason. And I even mentioned one concrete way that they reverberate today that is unimaginably worse than Affirmative Action (WoD).

> Why can't a Chinese person tell you that you have no qualms with racism - only with racism against black people?

Well first they'd have to determine if I support Affirmative Action...

> ...hierarchy of grievances... This is not however the only possible definition of racism, nor the original definition, nor the definition used in the report.

This discussion is about what the Chinese government chooses to emphasize. So context and degree both matter, because if China were truly critiquing racism then they'd choose the strongest argument available.

Re: Strategic Consequences of Chinese Racism: Strategic Asymmetry for the USA (2013) [pdf]

#75

Post by quotemstr »

SudoNhim wrote: post #69
chvid wrote: post #45

I find it odd to that this document is on the frontpage of HN. 200+ pages, no clear summary, unclear what it is it? Other than appearantly it is confidential who has written it, seemingly academic and it is about Chinese and/or China being racists. Where is this document from? And why was it written? "Racist" is probably the most damning word that one can use in politics (here international politics) and can be used…

It's from the Department of Defense litigation release a few months back. Have a look here: http://www.dod.mil/pubs/foi/Reading_Room/Other/ Most of these are anthropology reports commissioned by the DoD. A lot of them are super interesting. Examples: 2st Century Cultures of War http://www.dod.mil/pubs/foi/Reading_Room/Other/Litigation%20... Axis of Troubles: Male Youth and Factional Politics http://www.dod.mil/pubs/f…

Thanks. These are fascinating.
Post reply on HN