Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video] • Hacker News Board

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#101

Post by aargh_aargh » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 9:53 AM UTC

spangry wrote: post #51

joshpadnick wrote: post #31

This is really cool tech, but given the current political state, I can't help but worry about a powerful army of robots -- presumably with weapons attached -- being put into the hands of a leader we might consider to have "unreliable" judgement. I wonder: if a country can deploy an army of robots to achieve its military ends, how does that play out in the long run? Does this mean future wars will just be "our" droids…

In the short-medium term? It makes it easier for democratic countries to wage war, just or unjust. No more footage of coffins draped in flags coming off transport planes. No more soldiers coming home with PTSD or concussion-induced dementia. Just a bunch of guys in Langley, sitting in their cubicles, killing people on the other side of the world. The domestic propaganda goes down much smoother at this point. After al…

> Just a bunch of guys in Langley, sitting in their cubicles, killing people on the other side of the world.

I bet the lag would be terrible.

Remember Grace Hopper.

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#102

Post by SkyMarshal » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 10:19 AM UTC

Otherwise known as Parkourbot

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#103

Post by option_greek » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 10:20 AM UTC

What technologies do they use to do the balancing. I heard earlier that they don't use any machine learning at all. So what do they use to achieve this level of robustness.

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#104

Post by spangry » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 10:32 AM UTC

aargh_aargh wrote: post #101

spangry wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the short-medium term? It makes it easier for democratic countries to wage war, just or unjust. No more footage of coffins draped in flags coming off transport planes. No more soldiers coming home with PTSD or concussion-induced dementia. Just a bunch of guys in Langley, sitting in their cubicles, killing people on the other side of the world. The domestic propaganda goes down much smoother at this point. After al…

> Just a bunch of guys in Langley, sitting in their cubicles, killing people on the other side of the world. I bet the lag would be terrible. Remember Grace Hopper.

I'm actually not from the US so hadn't heard of her until now. But I just read about her, and it sounds like she was a pretty awesome lady! And now you've got me curious about the lag...

I'm guessing they could (would?) go most of the way via undersea cable (just as normal folks do), pop out somewhere close and then beam up to some satellite. I'm in Australia, and (I think) Puerto Rico is roughly on the other side of the word (although I did get a D in high school geography, so there's a good chance I'm wrong here). My round-trip ping time averages ~320ms to some random PR ISP (209.91.222.104). I have no idea how much extra latency a last-stage satellite hop would add in, but let's say it triples the latency.

Almost a second in lag. So pretty terrible. I guess they'd need to use characters, er drones, with good AoE attacks...

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#105

Post by jonnydark » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 10:33 AM UTC

option_greek wrote: post #103

What technologies do they use to do the balancing. I heard earlier that they don't use any machine learning at all. So what do they use to achieve this level of robustness.

The balancing stems from an inverted-pendulum problem, and that's something that's reasonably well understood in robotics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_pendulum

Of course it's more complicated than that because it looks as though the centre of mass can move and the legs can bend and are not rigid, but it would make more sense approaching this from a kinematics perspective rather than a ML one.

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#106

Post by return0 » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 10:49 AM UTC

elsewhen wrote: post #44

aeleos wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They were never actually sold, the only news related to it was back in march 2016 where alphabet said they were looking to sell. Afaik nothing has come up about it since.

and their about-us page still says that they are a "wholly owned subsidiary of Google, Inc." http://www.bostondynamics.com/bd_about.html

That should be Alphabet by now.

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#107

Post by codydh » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 11:36 AM UTC

imaginenore wrote: post #70

jameslk wrote: post #11

I can't wait for weapons to be attached to this thing so it can be used against us in the future. Imagine the part where it was spinning, but instead with a firing automatic weapon. What prevents democracy from collapsing when a certain technical elite control the most powerful autonomous weapons and keep tabs on everyone's daily lives?

Chances are, you don't live in a democracy anyway. Most "western" world is either a representative republic or the same mixed with a monarchy. Switzerland is the only country that gets close to a democracy - they let their citizens vote on many issues.

The Economist Intelligence Unit, amongst others, ranks countries on this dimension: http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2017/01/daily-c...

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#108

Post by lsh » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 11:56 AM UTC

alkonaut wrote: post #28

I'd like to see it fall and recover. These videos just aren't what they used to be since they stopped kicking them robots.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sAmyZP-qbTE

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#109

Post by TeMPOraL » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 11:56 AM UTC

aargh_aargh wrote: post #101

spangry wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the short-medium term? It makes it easier for democratic countries to wage war, just or unjust. No more footage of coffins draped in flags coming off transport planes. No more soldiers coming home with PTSD or concussion-induced dementia. Just a bunch of guys in Langley, sitting in their cubicles, killing people on the other side of the world. The domestic propaganda goes down much smoother at this point. After al…

> Just a bunch of guys in Langley, sitting in their cubicles, killing people on the other side of the world. I bet the lag would be terrible. Remember Grace Hopper.

> I bet the lag would be terrible.

If they could route the link through a constellation of LEO satellites, then the lag would probably be comparable to what you get in a typical multiplayer FPS. Ground to LEO and back is 1ms to 14ms, depending on how high in LEO the satellite is (assuming satellite directly above your head). Space is pretty close to us.

As for how to get that constellation up, well, SpaceX is working on making that pretty cheap.

Re: Introducing Handle – Boston Dynamics [video]

#110

Post by amelius » Tue, Feb 28, 2017, 12:06 PM UTC

Why do we always see the BD robots in real videos, and never in simulations? I mean, the mechanics are important, but the control system is much more important, and it's pure software.