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How a French scholar was treated at US airport

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Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#211

Post by purple-again »

torrent-of-ions wrote: post #139
monodeldiablo wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't encourage ill treatment of US citizens overseas. Americans who travel outside her borders are not the people making these decisions, tend to be much more worldly than the average citizen, and are the first to be horrified at these developments. If you want to make the US change, speak the language we speak: lawsuits. Sue, sue, sue. Call your embassy and demand that they pressure the White House to retrac…

They might not be making the decisions but they are the only ones who can affect them. How can foreigners demand that the US government changes its policy?

What power do you think the average citizen of the United States has to affect its government? A phone call to their senator (most likely ignored, best case you end up a tally in the nay yay spreadsheet, and either way it doesn't matter because they are going to vote the party line) and a vote on Election Day (hah!).

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#212

Post by areyousure »

KKKKkkkk1 wrote: post #131
pier25 wrote: post #122

In 2007 I crossed the border on bus going from Montreal to NY. The girl I was travelling with was accused of illegal importation of fruits because she was carrying an apple for the trip.

What happened to her?

Not your parent commenter, but I was on a bus once from Toronto to NYC. One of my fellow passengers had a coconut confiscated at the border. We all felt sorry for him, but when he got back on the bus, he pulled out a second coconut from his coat. :)

More interesting, my neighbor on that bus ride did not possess a passport nor even a photo ID! He was Amish and had no problems crossing the border. His papers (which I examined) included a handwritten description of his appearance.

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#213

Post by cr1895 »

cr1895 wrote: post #144
NoirDesir wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Member of the European Union, not member of the Schengen Area... UK has always been whimsical and not reflecting the "European" values... thus, UK is not Europe. They're free to run things the way they like, but please don't keep telling that UK is Europe... especially after they chose and got the Brexit... not a single true european will endorse its mistakes.

Brexit is solely related to UK membership within the European Union. It is wrong to conflate being a part of Europe with being a part of the European Union. Throughout history the ties between what is now the UK and what is now continental Europe are deep and inseparably intertwined (both culturally and geographically); it is absurd to to claim that the UK is "always whimsical" (whatever that means) and does not refl…

Too late to edit, but continental -> contiguous. UK is already continental Europe; they're on the same plate.

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#214

Post by mercer »

NoirDesir wrote: post #100
stereo wrote: post #87

This is nothing new, and the same thing happened to this American going to a conference in Europe in 2016: https://medium.com/@rachelnabors/wtfuk-73009d5623b4#.1079ksb... HN thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11876453

UK is not Europe.

To you and my sibling posts: could you both elaborate?

I'm inclined to agree that the UK differs from mainland Europe in a number of ways. I can't judge if this is the case for border control, but it wouldn't surprise. I'd really like to hear both sides elaborate rather than the 'yes', 'but no' comments so far.

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#215

Post by grzm »

cr1895 wrote: post #213
cr1895 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brexit is solely related to UK membership within the European Union. It is wrong to conflate being a part of Europe with being a part of the European Union. Throughout history the ties between what is now the UK and what is now continental Europe are deep and inseparably intertwined (both culturally and geographically); it is absurd to to claim that the UK is "always whimsical" (whatever that means) and does not refl…

Too late to edit, but continental -> contiguous. UK is already continental Europe; they're on the same plate.

The common understanding of continental Europe does exclude the U.K.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_Europe

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#216

Post by cr1895 »

grzm wrote: post #215
cr1895 wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Too late to edit, but continental -> contiguous. UK is already continental Europe; they're on the same plate.

The common understanding of continental Europe does exclude the U.K. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_Europe

Ah ok, thanks for the clarification. I was thinking in terms of Alaska vs the rest of the US.

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#217

Post by kahnpro »

xutopia wrote: post #152

I realize this is exceptional but I've spoken to a few Canadian friends who aren't bothering to visit the USA anymore. Avid travellers and hikes a lot of them are going to spend more time within their country and Europe during this presidency. The simple idea that we might have to give our social media passwords is revolting more than a few... this story just adds to this feeling.

As a Canadian, I absolutely actively avoid flights connecting through the US even if it's a few hundred cheaper. Not subjecting myself to the horror of US customs just to fly to Europe.

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#218

Post by mercer »

jacquesm wrote: post #156
yread wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Scary story. But read this one from the comments: >I’m not going to apologise. I’ve been fighting this brutal nonsense since I was an MP’s assistant in the late 1980s. At the time the system was that a Member of Parliament could intervene on any deportation and by contacting the Home Office get it stopped until any questionable aspects were resolved. One evening I was the last to leave the office when a call came thr…

Give small people a little bit of power and the results are very predictable. Real lives > paper, that's the bit that people in uniform the world over seem to instantly forget the moment they put on their work clothes in the morning. I've seen so many examples of this in my life by now that it hardly surprises me any more but I still absolutely boil at it every time I see another instance.

To be fair, this phenomenon is not exclusive to the uniformed. For example, I've talked to numerous freelancers who, after having a long discussion on the matter, basically admit to overcharging their small-business-owning clients in various ways.

They sell their clients 3000 euro WordPress sites with a custom theme where Wix/SquareSpace or one of the many solid $50 WordPress themes would suffice (or a plain custom theme for a few hundred bucks). A difference in money that is huge for a starting small business or freelancer!

Or worse, they sell a 3000 euro site with a self-built CMS and, when pressed, admit that part of the reason for not using WordPress or the like is that it makes the client rely on them more.

That's just an example in my field (or part of it). But based on the many odd jobs I've had and companies I've worked in, this is pretty common.

My impression so far is that when an interaction between people becomes an explicit transaction involving money, we sort of forget about the person and tend to think in more abstract measures like money or favors or whatnot. I don't like it, and (partly) as a result I'm making it harder for myself to get rich. Thankfully web development is enough in demand that I can make choices in the matter.

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#219

Post by snovv_crash »

geodel wrote: post #93
coldcode wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do not come to the US for any reason. Also, request that your government treat all US visitors exactly the same as this. Until people start to see how awful treating people like trash is nothing will change, it will only get worse. My job depends (somewhat) on foreign tourists coming to the US, I would rather lose my job than read these embarrassing stories.

Practically speaking, some first world countries might be able to hold US citizens in disdain. But for much of the third world the US tourists are big source of revenue and non tourists are usually important people on government or private business. So most nations can't afford to treat US citizens badly whether they want or not.

Maybe I don't speak for everyone, but I'd be more likely to go on holiday somewhere if I can be assured there are no US tourists there.

Re: How a French scholar was treated at US airport

#220

Post by shitgoose »

JeromeLon wrote: post #148
coldcode wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do not come to the US for any reason. Also, request that your government treat all US visitors exactly the same as this. Until people start to see how awful treating people like trash is nothing will change, it will only get worse. My job depends (somewhat) on foreign tourists coming to the US, I would rather lose my job than read these embarrassing stories.

I agree. I work in the UK, and used to go to SFO twice a year. I am now telling my manager that I am not willing to take the risk to be arbitrarily detained for no reason, even if it's only a 1% chance (which sounds about the current level). Send me to any country, but only where the rule of law applies.

"Send me to any country, but only where the rule of law applies"

which is?..

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