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AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

newscientist.com

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Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#61

Post by rorykoehler »

kleiba wrote: post #58
rorykoehler wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can describe something then you can just code it. I can see AI being used in an advanced IDE as an assistant. Just write your specs and let the AI build the app.

But wouldn't you agree that by the same line of reasoning, if you can spec it, you can code it? I mean, the difficulty lies in specifying what you want in such an unambiguous way that a program that fulfill the specification actually does what you had in mind originally.

Sure. Exactly what I meant. It would just speed up your job.

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#62

Post by unprepare »

kk_cz wrote: post #59
unprepare wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

making people in an industry more efficient at their jobs == job losses for that industry. if one programmer can now do the work of 5 with the help of an AI, companies will quickly be hiring less developers. yet everytime i mention this, im told that "software developers are the one job that will never be at risk of automation"

I would argue that every year programmers ARE more efficient at their jobs with adoption of new tools, frameworks and methodologies. Yet there is still not enough good developers.

yes and each new tool or helpful framework reduces the total number of developers needed. Just because we have yet to meet the demand for developers, doesn't mean that that demand is not decreasing over time.

software development is quite a young industry, so its growth can easily outpace the efficiency gains resulting in more developers, until it doesnt. Development as an industry will need to maintain stronger growth than efficiency gains through innovation, and i just dont see that happening long term.

edit: in my first paragraph i should have said " Just because we have yet to meet the demand for developers, doesn't mean that growth of that demand is not decreasing over time."

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#63

Post by scribu »

staticelf wrote: post #53
kleiba wrote: post #45

“It could allow non-coders to simply describe an idea for a program and let the system build it” This is not a new thought. The problem with it, however, is that such a description would have to be very precise or else leave room for different interpretations which in turn could lead to very different programs being generated. In particular, as programmers know, it's often the edge cases that pose the main difficulty…

Well, I think the are refering to that the computer would solve it's specific problems by itself just as we do as programmers. I guess that you have worked for someone else as a programmer? Didn't they tell you what they wanted? How did you achieve it? They probably didn't have to write it for you in very specific terms unless a problem occurrs.

They achieved it by making a lot of guesses, based on a huge amount of explicit and implicit knowledge about humans, computers and the world in general.

The brute-force approach described in the article, where you just randomly try lines of code without any other knowledge, won't make for a very competent programmer.

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#64

Post by williamdclt »

unprepare wrote: post #56
rorykoehler wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can describe something then you can just code it. I can see AI being used in an advanced IDE as an assistant. Just write your specs and let the AI build the app.

making people in an industry more efficient at their jobs == job losses for that industry. if one programmer can now do the work of 5 with the help of an AI, companies will quickly be hiring less developers. yet everytime i mention this, im told that "software developers are the one job that will never be at risk of automation"

Automation is always a good thing. Should we stop progress to allow humans to do some inefficient work? Society will have to change so that work is something done by machines, not humans.

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#66

Post by unprepare »

cabalamat wrote: post #60
unprepare wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

making people in an industry more efficient at their jobs == job losses for that industry. if one programmer can now do the work of 5 with the help of an AI, companies will quickly be hiring less developers. yet everytime i mention this, im told that "software developers are the one job that will never be at risk of automation"

> im told that "software developers are the one job that will never be at risk of automation" The AI is itself a program. If the AI can write programs, it can write a better version of itself. A few iterations of this, and it will have far surpassed human intelligence. So it would be more accurate to say that writing programs is the last job that will be automated.

I think things like psychology/psychiatry, social work, child protective services, and other jobs that rely on a lot of interpersonal communication will be around longer than development; at least at any scale worth talking about.

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#67

Post by kapv89 »

unprepare wrote: post #56
rorykoehler wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you can describe something then you can just code it. I can see AI being used in an advanced IDE as an assistant. Just write your specs and let the AI build the app.

making people in an industry more efficient at their jobs == job losses for that industry. if one programmer can now do the work of 5 with the help of an AI, companies will quickly be hiring less developers. yet everytime i mention this, im told that "software developers are the one job that will never be at risk of automation"

Here's my 2 cents on why software developers will never be at the risk of automation: https://medium.com/@kapv89/code-will-always-be-written-207d3...

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#68

Post by unprepare »

williamdclt wrote: post #64
unprepare wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

making people in an industry more efficient at their jobs == job losses for that industry. if one programmer can now do the work of 5 with the help of an AI, companies will quickly be hiring less developers. yet everytime i mention this, im told that "software developers are the one job that will never be at risk of automation"

Automation is always a good thing. Should we stop progress to allow humans to do some inefficient work? Society will have to change so that work is something done by machines, not humans.

I'm not making an argument that it is bad by any means, im only countering a common thread in development circles that 'development will never be at risk of automation'

for an example, see kapv89's response to my comment. Its a seemingly very prevalent view that somehow development will not suffer job losses from the efficiency gains innovation is able to create.

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#69

Post by geophile »

kleiba wrote: post #45

“It could allow non-coders to simply describe an idea for a program and let the system build it” This is not a new thought. The problem with it, however, is that such a description would have to be very precise or else leave room for different interpretations which in turn could lead to very different programs being generated. In particular, as programmers know, it's often the edge cases that pose the main difficulty…

Doesn't TDD basically provide a spec? Write a test, then let the AI generate a program that passes the test. If the program is still buggy, you didn't write sufficient tests.

Re: AI learns to write its own code by stealing from other programs

#70

Post by [deleted] »

kleiba wrote: post #45

“It could allow non-coders to simply describe an idea for a program and let the system build it” This is not a new thought. The problem with it, however, is that such a description would have to be very precise or else leave room for different interpretations which in turn could lead to very different programs being generated. In particular, as programmers know, it's often the edge cases that pose the main difficulty…

[deleted]
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