Sad to see some people here be upset at the harmless mention of a subject's race. Though it is proof positive to me that even a community as dedicated towards intellectual pursuits like Hacker News has its fair share of regressive elements as well.
The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
81–90 of 165 posts
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#82Oh I remember Archie! There was always a story it was named after the comic, and after it there were the Veronica and Jughead systems which were named the same way. I just checked then and Wikipedia says he didn't name it after the comic and hated it. So there goes another 1990's myth. Archie itself actually never worked very well, but nothing did in those days so we were amazed when it actually returned a result.
I can probably count the number of dinner parties I've been to on one hand. The only one I remember is the one where, in the mid-90s, we discussed the fact that the web was wonderful but there was no way to find anything.
And you didn't sense a start-up opportunity and beat Sergey, Larry and friends to the table?
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#83HN is sometimes one of the more progressive wings of the geek community. It's disheartening to see the number of replies expressing dismay at race being an interesting and notable part of this story. Representation is a crucial concept in history and media, and a key element in why conversations about privilege are necessary. Rather than stating that you don't know why it would be relevant to mention the man's race,…
> HN is sometimes one of the more progressive wings of the geek community.
I'll respectfully disagree with that. I think the rules set up in HN around both manual and automatic flagging mean that controversial stories quickly get buried, and only very straightforward, non-controversial articles get visibility.
Many users think this is a positive feature. I'm deeply ambivalent about it, but have come to accept that HN is simply not a place where controversial things are discussed with any measure of success. But don't mistake that for HN being a progressive haven.
EDIT: prophecy fulfilled. This submission got flagged off the homepage.
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#84Earlier quoted context omitted.
If your question is honest, I'll give you an honest answer: When you're a member of a minority that is commonly portrayed in the media as being an 'other' / 'not good enough' / 'not likely to succeed', this kind of identification is heartening. It shows you that people like you can succeed, people like you have succeeded, and people like you matter . I'm going to go ahead and assume you're not a part of a group that…
I find it demeaning to make it a point that someone from a certain race " actually succeeded this time! " It seems to me that in doing so, one also indirectly makes the point that most people from race X don't succeed. It's good sentiment at best and racism at worst.
You raise a valid point. Our celebration of "Minority successes" does often border on infantilization. This is a sentiment that comes up in the disability community: "I don't exist to inspire you, I just want to live my life and be respected like anyone else."
It's a fine line. As more fields (I.e, CS) have visible minority successes, this need will fade. But we are not there yet.
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
If your question is honest, I'll give you an honest answer: When you're a member of a minority that is commonly portrayed in the media as being an 'other' / 'not good enough' / 'not likely to succeed', this kind of identification is heartening. It shows you that people like you can succeed, people like you have succeeded, and people like you matter . I'm going to go ahead and assume you're not a part of a group that…
I find it demeaning to make it a point that someone from a certain race " actually succeeded this time! " It seems to me that in doing so, one also indirectly makes the point that most people from race X don't succeed. It's good sentiment at best and racism at worst.
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Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#86Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I understand the sentiment, but I also understand that if you truly want to get rid of racial bias, gender bias, whatever else bias completely, then not paying it mention in any sphere is how you get there. We lived in a world where racism exists, regardless of your own personal attitude. This is just like global climate change - simply because you personally are carbon neutral doesn't mean we don't have a systemat…
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Getting the interview in the first place is a good marker of the privileged upbringing that most tech industry job applicants have. The path to getting a high paying, high quality job interview is littered with cul-de-sacs where smart, hard working people without access to those same opportunities are asked to build their houses and stay for good. And class mobility (the American Dream) is mostly a myth (for a good and accessible look at this issue, check out the recent On the Media series on poverty, Busted http://www.wnyc.org/series/busted-americas-poverty-myths ), so hard work is not the way out either.
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#87Earlier quoted context omitted.
Then why is it strictly forbidden to write an article with a title that caters specifically to young white children?
Ignoring whether it's forbidden, I'm not sure it's useful. I don't remember having some identity tied to being "white" as a child. I think white children are more likely to identify as being "Catholic" or "of French ancestry" or "poor" or "from Philly" or some other dimension apart from race.
If there is no identity tied to being white, then how are there hundreds upon hundreds of articles in WaPo and the New York Times which almost literally say "White Men Ruin the World" and contain detailed accounts of how white supremacy won Trump the presidency?
Either you're right, and white supremacy is not a problem at all, or you're wrong, and culture today has made it acceptable to say "fuck white men", which is disgustingly racist and yet no one is willing to publicly acknowledge it except "white supremacists" themselves.
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
Black in this context is a race, which is an extremely broad spectrum of ethnicities and nationalities of various skin tones.
In any case, I don't know anyone who would consider this man to be black. Perhaps it's the lighting or angle of the photo?
Well, like I said. Black is a race, not necessarily a skin tone but mostly identified as a complex and arbitrary delineation of class, nationality, ethnicity, and general skin tone as the easiest identifier but not necessarily the qualifier. I have a white friend who's tan as hell, and studied under a woman from South Africa who was about as tan as my friend. The woman was considered a black woman, while my friend was considered a white man, even though their skin tones were similar.
Life is full of such arbitrary nuance and complexity.
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#89Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ignoring whether it's forbidden, I'm not sure it's useful. I don't remember having some identity tied to being "white" as a child. I think white children are more likely to identify as being "Catholic" or "of French ancestry" or "poor" or "from Philly" or some other dimension apart from race.
If there is no identity tied to being white, then how are there hundreds upon hundreds of articles in WaPo and the New York Times which almost literally say "White Men Ruin the World" and contain detailed accounts of how white supremacy won Trump the presidency? Either you're right, and white supremacy is not a problem at all, or you're wrong, and culture today has made it acceptable to say "fuck white men", which is…
Sure, there's some white identity. I'm questioning if there's enough to market to it as a specific segment.
I'm also not convinced that xenophobia is the same thing as white identity.
Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I understand the sentiment, but I also understand that if you truly want to get rid of racial bias, gender bias, whatever else bias completely, then not paying it mention in any sphere is how you get there. We lived in a world where racism exists, regardless of your own personal attitude. This is just like global climate change - simply because you personally are carbon neutral doesn't mean we don't have a systemat…
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The debate the OP is getting is this: 'people' vs. the individual. I think everyone agrees that the goal is for people to treat each others the exact same, but 'people' is a very messy concept.
Is it better for me, as an individual, to treat you the same as I do anyone else and wait for gradual societal pressure to push others to do the same, or is it better for me, as an individual, to highlight the oppression that very much still exists, in a bid to make others notice?
I don't think there is a right and wrong answer here, just different approaches to a problem. The good thing is that we can all agree the problem exists, which isn't always a given.