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The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

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Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#71

Post by empath75 »

firstworldman wrote: post #42

HN is sometimes one of the more progressive wings of the geek community. It's disheartening to see the number of replies expressing dismay at race being an interesting and notable part of this story. Representation is a crucial concept in history and media, and a key element in why conversations about privilege are necessary. Rather than stating that you don't know why it would be relevant to mention the man's race,…

Hacker News is full of alt-right people and trump supporters, which you'll see any time anything vaguely immigration, race or gender related gets posted. Just by nature of the subject matter, middle-aged white male libertarian types are going to be over-represented.

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#72

Post by treehau5 »

libertymcateer wrote: post #65
treehau5 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Removing my comments because this thread has sparked unnecessary discourse and reactions that this comment is the cause of.

> I understand the sentiment, but I also understand that if you truly want to get rid of racial bias, gender bias, whatever else bias completely, then not paying it mention in any sphere is how you get there. We lived in a world where racism exists, regardless of your own personal attitude. This is just like global climate change - simply because you personally are carbon neutral doesn't mean we don't have a systemat…

[removed]

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#73

Post by tyingq »

gragas wrote: post #50
bglazer wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can tell you why it's important to note the race of an underrepresented minority who made a notable contribution. I teach programming to a group of black young adults. Self image is very important to most young folks. Just seeing other black people who are successful computer programmers helps them imagine themselves as computer programmers. Identity matters to young people who are trying to shape their own self im…

Then why is it strictly forbidden to write an article with a title that caters specifically to young white children?

Ignoring whether it's forbidden, I'm not sure it's useful. I don't remember having some identity tied to being "white" as a child. I think white children are more likely to identify as being "Catholic" or "of French ancestry" or "poor" or "from Philly" or some other dimension apart from race.

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#74

Post by noobermin »

Starwatcher2001 wrote: post #46
nl wrote: post #2

Oh I remember Archie! There was always a story it was named after the comic, and after it there were the Veronica and Jughead systems which were named the same way. I just checked then and Wikipedia says he didn't name it after the comic and hated it. So there goes another 1990's myth. Archie itself actually never worked very well, but nothing did in those days so we were amazed when it actually returned a result.

I recall using Archie, Wais and Gopher under MSDOS using clients pulled from FTP sites. Although useful, it wasn't until I discovered usenet that the world really opened up for me.

I was thinking, people proclaim that Google and internet search (like yahoo) in general precipitated the dawn of the internet, but what use is search if there's nothing to search for? Or at least no one knows what exists to search for?

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#75

Post by danbruc »

maxerickson wrote: post #61
danbruc wrote: post #56

This escalated quickly. But I would actually somewhat side with the commenters saying that it is odd to explicitly mention the race in the article. I get that it is Black History Month in the US and in that context it seems appropriate but I would question whether having a Black History Month is a good idea in the first place. It is not obvious to me that explicitly pointing out a distinction is the best way to get r…

There are not many efforts to get rid of distinctions. People mostly work to get rid of unfair discrimination that is based on an arbitrary distinction.

That is of cause what I was referring to, you would certainly not attempt to get rid of different skin colors, sexes or sexual orientations to achieve equal treatment for all.

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#76

Post by firstworldman »

treehau5 wrote: post #52
firstworldman wrote: post #42

HN is sometimes one of the more progressive wings of the geek community. It's disheartening to see the number of replies expressing dismay at race being an interesting and notable part of this story. Representation is a crucial concept in history and media, and a key element in why conversations about privilege are necessary. Rather than stating that you don't know why it would be relevant to mention the man's race,…

Removing my comments because this thread has sparked unnecessary discourse and reactions that this comment is the cause of.

I think that the solution lies in shining a light on, and whenever possible, celebrating differences, not ignoring them. Maybe some far off day we will be 'one people', after a few (dozen) generations of widespread interracial coupling, but that mostly misses the point.

There are real divisions between people, socially constructed ones. That will likely always persist, and discussing categorical representation (or lack thereof) is an important part of making genuine strides toward diversity (in the workplace, in culture, etc). The goal is not to have everybody be the same, it's to make the 'thing' representative of the the diverse people that make up the 'thing'.

Do you not agree that a young black kid deserves black heroes that she can relate her own story to? Why ignore that aspect of the story?

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#77

Post by treehau5 »

djtriptych wrote: post #69
treehau5 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[removed]

It's irresponsible to mention quotas and affirmative action, but not the systemic (and legal) racism and sexism that made those programs necessary in the first place.

[removed]

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#78

Post by makomk »

pessimizer wrote: post #53
firstworldman wrote: post #42

HN is sometimes one of the more progressive wings of the geek community. It's disheartening to see the number of replies expressing dismay at race being an interesting and notable part of this story. Representation is a crucial concept in history and media, and a key element in why conversations about privilege are necessary. Rather than stating that you don't know why it would be relevant to mention the man's race,…

> It's disheartening to see the number of replies expressing dismay at race being an interesting and notable part of this story. If only. Far worse is the number of replies saying that he isn't black enough. It's so weird when you get racially policed by white people if you don't conform to a media stereotype, or if you're not dark enough. How about "of sub-Saharan African descent?" Also, it shouldn't be confusing th…

All those comments about whether someone is black are a pretty much inevitable result of turning race - which is something that, when it comes down to it, is basically made-up nonsense anyway - into the most important defining characteristic of someone. Doesn't matter if you're doing it for progressive or discriminatory reasons, either way the whole charade ends up running headlong into the reality that people don't actually fit all that well into those neat little racial categories.

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#79

Post by libertymcateer »

dbaupp wrote: post #66
treehau5 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Removing my comments because this thread has sparked unnecessary discourse and reactions that this comment is the cause of.

Ah yes, if you truly want to get rid of bugs in your software, then not mentioning them is the best way to get there. Start acting like your code has no bugs now! The status quo doesn't change if people don't talk about, analyse and challenge it.

"Fuck it, ship it" as applied to bugs in political systems... I like it.

Maybe it can help get through to people who write code all day that racism is built up technical debt, and ignoring it doesn't mean it will go away?

Re: The Black Technologist Who Invented the First Internet Search Engine

#80

Post by noobermin »

empath75 wrote: post #71
firstworldman wrote: post #42

HN is sometimes one of the more progressive wings of the geek community. It's disheartening to see the number of replies expressing dismay at race being an interesting and notable part of this story. Representation is a crucial concept in history and media, and a key element in why conversations about privilege are necessary. Rather than stating that you don't know why it would be relevant to mention the man's race,…

Hacker News is full of alt-right people and trump supporters, which you'll see any time anything vaguely immigration, race or gender related gets posted. Just by nature of the subject matter, middle-aged white male libertarian types are going to be over-represented.

I don't think so. HN has a mix of all types, and in my opinion, the group has a nice mix of progressives and some libertarians. But given most libertarian stories, like involving online privacy, the two groups overlap, it gives people a false impression that HN leans libertarian in general.

The alt-righters pop up once and again but they are usually downvoted out[0] when they turn to race baiting and blatant propaganda (posting of sketchy research supporting inherent differences between the races, for example).

[0] Hell, just look at the comments down in this section.

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