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Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

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Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#91

Post by bravefoot »

CamelCaseName wrote: post #62
grandalf wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Say the average wage is $10/hour. If it takes one hour to go and do that shopping, I break even by paying someone else that $10, if I value my leisure time as equivalent to my wage. More likely, most Instacart customers earn much more than $10/hour. For someone with a busy work schedule, there might be 2 hours of leisure time available per day during the week. This means that by using Instacart I increase my after-wo…

When I go to a physical store I frequently end up buying things I didn't really intend to, but with Instacart, I only end up with the things I actually wanted. Specifically what products do you end up buying? I have always wanted some insight as to who buys these items near the register and why, as I rarely see anyone pick them up.

Half of my pantry is food I found in the clearance and damaged goods sections. I never go to the store with the intent of buying three big cans of enchilada sauce, but the bent ones are half off and I'll use them eventually...

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#92

Post by rdlecler1 »

paulcole wrote: post #64
grandalf wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Say the average wage is $10/hour. If it takes one hour to go and do that shopping, I break even by paying someone else that $10, if I value my leisure time as equivalent to my wage. More likely, most Instacart customers earn much more than $10/hour. For someone with a busy work schedule, there might be 2 hours of leisure time available per day during the week. This means that by using Instacart I increase my after-wo…

>I break even by paying someone else that $10, if I value my leisure time as equivalent to my wage. I value my leisure time at the arbitrary amount of $1000/hr. Have I broken even if I pay $1000 to someone so they'll do my grocery shopping?

This principal is why we don't make our own shoes and milk our own cows, just at a different scale.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#93

Post by motoboi »

jjfine wrote: post #82
grandalf wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that is exactly why people part with money in exchange for things they could do equally well on their own.

I disagree. In the example, I think, they've been robbed.

Is it a robbery if you agree on the price _before_ the service is done?

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#94

Post by dawnerd »

matt_wulfeck wrote: post #5

> Instead of the tipping option appearing on the checkout page as it originally had, a default 10 percent “service fee” sat in its place. If I could take a guess, I'd say this is more related to the user experience. I hate tipping. I'd rather just attach a 10-20% fee instead of needlessly evaluating someone else's performance with every delivery. Or better yet, I'd rather just use a company that adequately pays its o…

I feel like even if they paid their delivery people a reasonable wage they'd still expect tips. Ive had movers that made over 50/hour not including the cost of materials/truck/etc ask for a tip.

I was all for Uber being tip free until drivers started driving for Lyft which does tips in-app, and now all the drivers expect it.

I've always felt this way with Pizza. Most places charge a delivery fee. That itself should be the tip. If it costs more to deliver a pizza then work it into the price.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#95

Post by 0xcde4c3db »

jjfine wrote: post #71
CamelCaseName wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I go to a physical store I frequently end up buying things I didn't really intend to, but with Instacart, I only end up with the things I actually wanted. Specifically what products do you end up buying? I have always wanted some insight as to who buys these items near the register and why, as I rarely see anyone pick them up.

They're not necessarily talking about just those items. The entire store is designed so you buy things you weren't intending to buy. You never said/thought: "Ooh look ice cream's on sale..." and failed to resist?

People will do that without even realizing it because they (we, I) instantly come up with some rationalization for why they "really" want it.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#96

Post by dawnerd »

vaishaksuresh wrote: post #87
rm999 wrote: post #66

Wait a minute... wait. Those service fees I've been opting to pay haven't been going to the shoppers/drivers who are processing my order? On my last order I asked the shopper to specifically go out of her way to check on an out of stock item. I did this with the assumption that my 7 dollar service fee was going directly to her, and that she would therefore be happy to go out of her way. When the delivery person (I th…

I think DoorDash does similar thing. You pay Tip, Service Fee, and Tax. It would still be ok if the food was being delivered from far off, but most of the time it is within a 2-5 mile radius. A $20 order easily becomes a $40 order.

Postmates is pretty bad about that. Oh, you want someone a block away? 7.99 fee + minimum order + tip.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#97

Post by aangjie »

nathanaldensr wrote: post #36

When are we as a society going to tire of company executives feigning stupidity and ignorance when it comes to these very deliberate actions ? All these executives--and likely all the developers, too--know exactly why these business model and app changes were made. The reasons given in the article are completely accurate. It can be boiled down to this: Money > People.

It's called Hanlon's Dodge, built on the Hanlon's razor principle. it'll keep happening as long as there's a popular belief in Hanlon's razor.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#98

Post by mathattack »

tyre wrote: post #8

They have tens of thousands of customers, yet are worth multiple billions of dollars (valued at $2bn in 2015.) That's just incredible. Let's say they have 100k customers who each use the service every week. That's 5.2m orders per year. Let's say $100 per order, to be generous. At a 10% service fee, that's $50m for a two-year-old 40x revenue multiple. Before paying their contracted workforce. This does not make sense.…

I applaud your willingness to edit. I am bearish on Instacart, but acknowledge that you shouldn't value them based on current cash flows.

It's half a bet on massive growth combined with eventual profitability, and half a bet on some massive non-linear outcome. (For example: search -> ads, or books -> hosting)

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#99

Post by nostrademons »

tyre wrote: post #18
trevyn wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tens of thousands of shoppers , not customers.

I think you might be right, but this is confusing since an instacart user is also a shopper? Not sure what the right language is, but I'll revise my post :+1:

Instacart's shoppers are its employees.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#100

Post by joncalhoun »

valkea wrote: post #90
robertcope wrote: post #85

I'm unclear why I would tip my Instacart delivery person. I order A, B, and C; my expectation is that A, B, and C show up, because that is what I paid for. How can a particular delivery person do that "better" enough to deserve a tip?

Pick out better produce?

It is hard to evaluate if the delivery person did the best they could with what the store had or just grabbed random produce. So now we are ripping drivers because the grocery store for a fresh produce delivery?

I'm not saying the lack of tips doesn't hurt drivers, but I agree that I have no idea how I could determine when a tip is justified.

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