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Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

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Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#51

This sounds extremely scummy, and if the story really is as simple as this article tells it I don't understand how the CEO of this company can look at himself in the mirror. I think a great example of an app that lets me give positive feedback to service people is Uber. They let you get a ride ASAP with as little decision making as possible, and then you can rate it after you get where you're going and you have some…

Uber has pulled numerous moves that have reduced driver compensation.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#52

This sounds extremely scummy, and if the story really is as simple as this article tells it I don't understand how the CEO of this company can look at himself in the mirror. I think a great example of an app that lets me give positive feedback to service people is Uber. They let you get a ride ASAP with as little decision making as possible, and then you can rate it after you get where you're going and you have some…

> They definitely don't make drivers have to hand out paper flyers in order to feed their family.

Yea with Uber the drivers are just forced to grovel for your 5-star rating or face not getting future fares.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#53
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Star ratings allow Uber to compensate top performers without creating an inconvenient friction point for users. Uber drivers with a high rating get paid more?

If they don't it's a big mistake by Uber. But at least the infrastructure is in place for collecting detailed ratings and feedback.

They don't get paid more but they'll be chosen first when a user requests a ride (I think they also drop low-star drivers)

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#54
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So then your answer is no, because then the venture owners don't own the company.

I didn't realize your comment exclusively pertained to venture owners. Even so a venture owner could sell the company to the employees and move on to their next big thing.

You're right that it's something a venture owner could do.

But then, you'd be surprised at how many highly-compensated programmers never bother to exercise their options. The same ones who then go on Hacker News and complain about bad treatment of workers, and how if only they owned the companies.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#55
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Profit has to come from somewhere. You can't reimburse the workers the full value of their labour if you wish to make a profit. I'd say that counts as exploitation. Unfortunate, but thats the reality of capitalism.

Sure, but there's some space between "full value of one's labor" and table scraps.

Of course, but when the decision of where the workers pay is on that scale is taken out of the hands of the workers, it tends towards table scraps then full value.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#56
post #8

They have tens of thousands of customers, yet are worth multiple billions of dollars (valued at $2bn in 2015.) That's just incredible. Let's say they have 100k customers who each use the service every week. That's 5.2m orders per year. Let's say $100 per order, to be generous. At a 10% service fee, that's $50m for a two-year-old 40x revenue multiple. Before paying their contracted workforce. This does not make sense.…

I use Instacart because I don't own a car and convenience. When I'm making $60 an hour overtime during the weekend for a 12-14 hour shift, you bet I'm going to be using Instacart for a nominal 10% markup for groceries from Costco.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#57
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Star ratings allow Uber to compensate top performers without creating an inconvenient friction point for users. Uber drivers with a high rating get paid more?

If they don't it's a big mistake by Uber. But at least the infrastructure is in place for collecting detailed ratings and feedback.

Does Uber make efforts to increase star ratings for drivers or is it all up to the driver? I was a quality manager for a call center and bad ratings can happen to even the best people. We always worked with them to improve for the future. We also did not rely exclusively on customer ratings and used internal QA. Does Uber have internal QA for drivers?

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#58
Not a US citizen but I find the whole tipping experience rather stressful and an additional item to worry about. I like it that Uber has it built into the service and there's only one thing to pay. I'd rather pay a flat increase on the menu and expect higher staff salaries than to have the delivery boy/waiter be at my mercy of tipping.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#59
I don't understand the outrage, I like Amazon Fresh even more, next to the tipping box it specifically says in big letters tipping is neither required nor expected and defaults to zero. If the current laws regarding minimum wage are inadequate why not try to pass new laws instead of trying to read between the lines on why Instacart moved an input box and put it somewhere else?

Why keep things murky? If it is against the law we have a justice system, I will not all of a sudden be reminded of greedy bankers on Wall Street being the reason that box was moved to a different screen. Do people benefit when things are less crystal clear? Why do we want them to stay that? Why should the tradition of tipping should still be alive in this country? What are we trying to prove? Who is benefiting? Do we enjoy this sadistic power imbalance every time we get a meal at a restaurant? Is it because it gives us control over livelihood of someone else? How is it any different that the Romans throwing Christians to the lions for their enjoyment? Let's create a society that we think is fair and just instead of trying to take things in our own hands. Engaging in social debate to win over your fellow citizens to see eye to eye with you on things like increasing the minimum wage would be a benefit not only to those at the bottom but also to the society as a whole if that's what you think is the right thing to do.

Re: Instacart is playing games with its workers’ pay

#60

Not a US citizen but I find the whole tipping experience rather stressful and an additional item to worry about. I like it that Uber has it built into the service and there's only one thing to pay. I'd rather pay a flat increase on the menu and expect higher staff salaries than to have the delivery boy/waiter be at my mercy of tipping.

Note there have been several articles about how some Uber drivers give lower ratings to riders who don't tip in cash.
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