121–130 of 198 posts
The key here is "developer". A web developer can learn to write code for a pretty website. This only requires very basic knowledge and essentially no math is involved. In contrast, an engineer or computer scientist capable of working as an applied mathematician definitely requires an advance degree. I laugh when webdevs call themselves engineers.
The really funny thing is asking a computer scientist to engineer a web page.
Succeed personally: no. Some dev jobs obviously require a lot of foundational knowledge. I wouldn't want to have a colleague who didn't know linear algebra, simply because that's important in my field. That's not important for making Wordpress sites. I think there are things "every good developer should know" such as knowledge about how cpus work, how OS'es work, how some important algorithms work, some basic set the…
With everything that's available in documentation, on YouTube, in forums, and in boot camps and other trainings, doesn't it seem like there are much more efficient ways to get the foundational knowledge that don't require four years of expensive college courses?
Step two: Package that with a bunch of people (both experienced and inexperienced) who can help with coursework and answer questions when they come up, teams of people to work with, somewhere to live with dozens of others doing the same work, hundreds more learning unrelated things (but who might be useful to you in the future), and you've got something close to a replacement for college.
I sometimes find it hard to discuss some subjects with some of my co-workers that don't have some degree directly related to computer science. For instance, it's very common for electrical engineers to work on software development and they tend to have a good grasp of how things work in the lower level, but when you start moving up in the abstraction ladder, the discussion starts to become harder. Compilers, types, a…
Can you elaborate (more) what would be required to "fill the gap" to an 80% sufficient extent? Perhaps a list of links / topics / keywords that should be checked out and read about? Perhaps it's possible to get up to speed with ~6 months of self-study...
I assume numerical analysis, probability and even assembly are subjects most people from engineering would already have some familiarity with.
More specific subjects include relational algebra (for relational databases) and AI concepts like neural nets.
Succeed personally: no. Some dev jobs obviously require a lot of foundational knowledge. I wouldn't want to have a colleague who didn't know linear algebra, simply because that's important in my field. That's not important for making Wordpress sites. I think there are things "every good developer should know" such as knowledge about how cpus work, how OS'es work, how some important algorithms work, some basic set the…
> I think there are things "every good developer should know" such as knowledge about how cpus work, how OS'es work Considering the complexity of modern CPU's and OS's, does college go into enough depth to tech them well or does it just let students think they know how they work?
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IIRC, the article says that a whopping 56% of developers don't have a degree. Given that the majority of developers don't have a degree, I'm not sure I'd agree with saying " without one, your options are very limited". Maybe "somewhat limited"? My anecdotal evidence, looking at both my own career and a lot of developers I've worked with over the past 17 years, is that having a degree, or not, isn't a big deal.
What could be true with the last generation may not necessarily hold true for the next generation. Many are working towards abstracting schooling out of a being a developer, great. That also means we're moving towards making being a developer a blue collar job rather than a white collar job. We're also making private businesses now the trainers of labor. The time to be a dropout rockstar developer was in the 2000s bu…
We're going to make software development into a job involving manual labor?
It depends, as it is not the same to be a first aid officer to a dentist, a physiotherapist or surgeon. In some cases you need a higher degree than in others.
The same with software development, IT, etc.
That being said, a diploma from whatever institution with whatever major, honors, or other kind of augmentation is simply a very expensive piece of paper. Getting a good grade in a course, or doing well in a series of courses brings about precious little practical knowledge in and of itself. And that piece of paper says very little about things that matter a good deal - like character, work ethic, and the ability to work well with others.
Relevant experience trumps everything. Barring that, near experience and a desire to learn come next. I'm big on people having a solid foundation, but my experience tells me that even the best schools turn out people with shaky foundational knowledge. People without degrees suffer the same analysis. Some are good, some are bad.
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The idea of "open source" is also unique, I can't think of any other professions that have something analogous.
Closed source is what is unique. I can tear apart any engine to understand how it works. I can rip out the bathroom in my house and install a totally new one. With closed source, I can't just rip out component X and replace it with component Y. I can't read the binary to understand how it works (Technically I could, but I mean that with modern languages, the assembly looks massively different from the original source…
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None. At least not on the first 9 months. Mostly it has been about performance, data structures, algorithms, and time complexities. So far, the first part (9 months) the focus is mostly on practical project-based learning and skills for developers. But we are encouraged to learn on our own. I certainly know about uncountable sets and the Axiom of Choice, but how much do I really need for the problems I am solving on…
Thank you for answering my question. Unfortunately, I must inform you that that is the answer I feared. There's a strong tendency for would-be "better options" and bootcamps to discard CS fundamentals and theory in favor of practical education. I am of the opinion that this sacrifices long-term practical utility for short-term utility. While seemingly of obvious benefit to those seeking jobs in the not-so-distant fut…
On the other hand though, I wouldn't presume to write my own cryptographic protocol without having the fundamentals myself. Wouldn't you say that it's actually reasonable to learn this on your own? There are so many options, paid, or free, that can help you with this. You could take a Coursera class, or follow an open source curriculum like someone said in the comments down below.
You did say "most individuals" struggle to learn in such a way, but the argument can be made that individuals studying cryptographic principles are not "most people", which, if not intelligence, shows a special kind of perseverence and dedication that will also differentiate them in self-study. I wouldn't say what you're saying is immediately obvious.
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Almost no-one has "secret painting methods", or "secret plumbing methods". For plumbing, building codes dictate the range of solutions that are available for any given problem, and they're not secret (but buying a guide can be expensive.) However, painters, plumbers, and other trades definitely have tips and techniques that they've learned through experience and from mentors, and you won't find much of that being giv…
> However, painters, plumbers, and other trades definitely have tips and techniques that they've learned through experience and from mentors, and you won't find much of that being given away freely. Exactly this. My father is a civil engineer who's now in his early 60s, and he recently got to work with colleagues much younger than him. He told me that said colleagues didn't know some trade-related stuff which hadn't…
I'm curious enough to ask: why?