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Google Spreadsheets and Python

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Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#131

Post by snuxoll »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #90
snuxoll wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For simple needs Salesforce isn't even that expensive, we have around ~38 "App Cloud" licenses - that adds up to $950/mo to not deal with data scattered everywhere, not needing to waste my time designing a full CRUD app with security, managing a database server, etc. It helps to have an experienced Salesforce admin though, I love the "citizen developer" that Salesforce always preaches but you can run into a mess if y…

Salesforce sells a lot of "best practices" that sometimes aren't, but so many young developers(and even architects) buy into. You are leaving out storage costs. There's a minimum record size and then per licence billing, something like $250/GB/month. If anyone needs some info/consulting - PM me via email in profile.

Storage costs are certainly something to be weary of, and something I have always hone through great efforts to minimize.

We have just over 5GB of total storage in our org and are only using ~45MB after a year because we planned out model around both storage efficiency and a sane data model.

You don't use fully normalized database designs in Salesforce if you can avoid it.

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#132

Post by rebootthesystem »

victorhooi wrote: post #122
rebootthesystem wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get all the good things Google Apps do. It's wonderful. Yet, until Google has a "contract with our users" that includes a level of customer service and human conflict resolution I would not touch them with a ten foot pole. Why? Because they could take it all away --and I do mean ALL-- overnight. Email, apps, etc. I've seen many people run into the Google ban for reasons not more complicated than not being experts a…

In terms of your anecdote about your client's experience - I can't speak to this, as I'm not directly familiar with this "Google for Domains" service and I don't have enough details from your post to comment. However, I can assure you that Google definitely has a customer support department - I work with them every day =). Also - it's important to distinguish between the free products we offer - and the paid products…

You might not know the answer to this question. If you don't, it might be interesting to see if you can get to the answer internally.

Let's say I setup a site and have AdSense place ads on it. I don't touch any of the ads. I never click any of them. Yet, for some reason, the ads see a bunch of click activity. The reasons can be many, from sheer randomness to a competitor using it as an attack vector (to deny revenue and more).

I have seen this precise scenario lead to the absolute shutdown of a Google account. And that means every single service, including email and docs. Gone. Done. No recourse. No way to even recover the data.

Has this changed?

Do you have a way for people affected by such algorithmic issues to engage in a conversation with something that does not resemble a totalitarian regime?

The paid vs. free part is immaterial. People are relying on your products and offerings. Free is a strategy for dominance. I can understand free products not having a human in the loop. What I can't understand is the dictatorial/totalitarian relationship with your users, who, free or not, have come to rely on these tools.

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#133

Post by tomlock »

ghostly_s wrote: post #44
skj wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not part of the drive/docs suite.

Yep, this should be accessible to users. Someone needs to bridge that gap from spreadsheets to real apps. One click to convert your Spreadsheet into a database. Or hell, just silently migrate it when (NUMROWS + NUMCOLUMNS) > BIGNUMBER .

Honestly, if clippy suggested to excel users something similar, I'd be extremely happy.

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#134

Post by j_s »

hueving wrote: post #114
j_s wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably because they are in business to make money? Customers whose first priority is cost usually aren't good customers.

That's a daft statement. Every customer cares about cost. The only difference is the price points. If that saying meant anything meaningful, Walmart, Safeway, Ford, etc would not exist. I think what you meant to say was, "don't target customers not willing to pay enough for a profit margin." Much less catchy, but at least it's not bullshit.

I said: "Customers whose first priority is cost" (emphasis added)

You said: "Every customer cares about cost"

There's a world of difference right there!

Appreciate you taking the time to comment but starting with "That's a daft statement" and ending with "bullshit", throwing in "I think what you want to say" for good measure? I must have hit a sore spot!

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#135

Post by victorhooi »

cyberpanther wrote: post #124
victorhooi wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding your claim about SLAs - there actually is an SLA for all of the paid Google Cloud products - e.g. the following would apply for GSuite, which covers Google Sheets: https://support.google.com/work/answer/6056635?hl=en https://gsuite.google.com/terms/reseller_sla.html If you mean the free products e.g. Google Sheets with a consumer account - AFAIK, there isn't a contractual SLA per-se, but the uptime is prett…

But does that cover the API and if devs break something during a release? That's where I see the problem often. New API gets released that breaks something but the broken thing doesn't get fixed quickly.

Yes, the SLA does cover the API - these fall under the main product.

The status dashboard (https://www.google.com/appsstatus#hl=en&v=status) lists what's covered or not covered - table at the top is all covered services (e.g. GMail, Google Drives/Docs/Sheets/Slides, Google+, Google Groups, Hangouts, Calendar etc.)

The table at the bottom lists things that aren't covered (e.g. Blogger, Google Voice, Google Analytics, Google Realtime API) by the SLA.

I believe you can find the list of covered/non-covered service on the support site as well (https://support.google.com/).

And what do you mean by devs break something during the release?

Do you mean if we introduce a bug in the code, and it affects the availability of the API? Yes, that is covered as well.

You mention you've seen this before - I can't promise anything, but if you're hitting any issues here, or roadblocks, and you're a GSuite customer (i.e. you are paying us some kind of money, even if it's $5 a month), I can certainly try looking into it for you - ping me your details and I can reach out.

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#136

Post by victorhooi »

rebootthesystem wrote: post #132
victorhooi wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of your anecdote about your client's experience - I can't speak to this, as I'm not directly familiar with this "Google for Domains" service and I don't have enough details from your post to comment. However, I can assure you that Google definitely has a customer support department - I work with them every day =). Also - it's important to distinguish between the free products we offer - and the paid products…

You might not know the answer to this question. If you don't, it might be interesting to see if you can get to the answer internally. Let's say I setup a site and have AdSense place ads on it. I don't touch any of the ads. I never click any of them. Yet, for some reason, the ads see a bunch of click activity. The reasons can be many, from sheer randomness to a competitor using it as an attack vector (to deny revenue…

I believe you're referring her to Adwords clickfraud - is that right? I don't work on that team, so can't comment on their policies (and even if I did, I probably can't comment publicly).

However, my understanding is normally AdWords accounts are suspended for billing/fraud related reasons (e.g. you don't pay your bills) - e.g.:

https://support.google.com/adwords/answer/2375414?hl=en-AU

If you AdWords account does get suspended, there's a form to appeal it here:

https://support.google.com/adwords/contact/pf_suspended

I haven't seen it lead immediately to the actual Google login itself being suspended. However, if your the actual Google account was suspended - there is a set procedure you can follow to un-suspend it - there should have been a link in the notification email.

Also - paid or free isn't immaterial - it actually does make a difference.

If it's a free account (E.g. @gmail.com), you can fill in the online forms to appeal the suspension.

If it's a paid account (i.e. part of a GSuite domain - or it's old name, Google for Work), then what often happens are individual accounts are suspended, and you talk to your own domain administrator to get that resolved. There are ways to get a domain suspended (e.g. you don't pay your bills) but they're usually fairly obvious.

(Disclaimer: I work for Google, but the above comments are my own opinions).

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#138

Post by beojan »

f_allwein wrote: post #2

I think there's a bit of a gap in the software ecosystem today in that there's no tool that lets semi-technical people like myself create simple applications, e.g. to read and write to databases. Bit like MS Access used to do. Google Spreadsheets actually goes a long way (I've done some stuff using the IF function etc. in it), but obviously has its limits. So combining it with Python sounds interesting. Not sure if i…

MS Access hasn't gone anywhere, why not use it?

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#139

Post by rebootthesystem »

victorhooi wrote: post #136
rebootthesystem wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might not know the answer to this question. If you don't, it might be interesting to see if you can get to the answer internally. Let's say I setup a site and have AdSense place ads on it. I don't touch any of the ads. I never click any of them. Yet, for some reason, the ads see a bunch of click activity. The reasons can be many, from sheer randomness to a competitor using it as an attack vector (to deny revenue…

I believe you're referring her to Adwords clickfraud - is that right? I don't work on that team, so can't comment on their policies (and even if I did, I probably can't comment publicly). However, my understanding is normally AdWords accounts are suspended for billing/fraud related reasons (e.g. you don't pay your bills) - e.g.: https://support.google.com/adwords/answer/2375414?hl=en-AU If you AdWords account does ge…

You are confusing your own products. AdSense. Not AdWords.

The various forms Google makes available for appealing suspensions are pretty much useless.

I urge you not to believe what I am saying here as well as not feeding within your own internal echo chamber. Use your own search product to search the 'net for the thousands of stories of various forms of algorithmic account suspensions, the damage they cause and how frustrating it is to get anywhere with Google.

Based on what I've witnessed personally and what I've read online the idea of relying on Google products for anything business critical terrifies me.

You --Google-- needs to truly care for it's clients and, as I said in a prior post, issue a guarantee. I am NOT talking about a guarantee of uptime for a service, that's irrelevant here.

What I am referring to are guarantees of service longevity as well as protection and recourse from algorithmic account suspensions. A business person needs to have the ability to address and discuss misunderstandings or problems and not have their entire Google-provided infrastructure evaporate overnight with nowhere to go.

To me the matter of free vs. paid is immaterial. Google and companies like Google use free services to gather and monetize audiences. For example, nobody would pay for search. Nobody would pay for a Facebook account. So you use free to bait the hook and capture audiences. This is a technique as old as the Internet, with browsers such as Netscape and earlier being the first land-grab-through-free-products.

If you are going to have a virtual monopoly by resorting to free products you also have to have the responsibility of not causing your user base irreparable damage by pulling those product either by early termination of the services or termination or suspension of account without recourse. At the moment you are large enough to not have to care about this one bit and nobody has challenged you in court for this terrible issue.

Start here and read through a few pages of links:

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&e...

Re: Google Spreadsheets and Python

#140

Post by olivier1664 »

jasoncrawford wrote: post #103
phillc73 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you spend a couple of minutes to describe the advantages of Airtable over Fieldbook or Ragic? I've been gripped by indecision regarding which tool to use, and hence use none of them.

Fieldbook co-founder here, thought I would weigh in. I agree with Howie that he doesn't spend much time using Fieldbook, since we already have many of the features he mentioned. IMHO Fieldbook has the best user experience anywhere for building and working with a real relational data model, including many-to-many relationships, sophisticated queries, and aggregated reports. We've done a ton of iteration with real user…

It seems cool. Have you consider letting us trying the demo without asking for credential? The login form have stop me since I do not want to be contacted by your sales.
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