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The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

theatlantic.com

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Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#21

Post by Natsu »

Animats wrote: post #18

Crowd-sourcing news quality does not work. There's no ground truth. Google News is suffering from this. I noted on Wikipedia today, in a discussion of reliable sources, that I had searched for info about a Wikipedia topic with Google news search, with terrible results. The top three results were Algemeiner (Jewish), Breitbart News (alt-right), and Mondoweiss ("progressive and anti-Zionist"). This is pathetic.

Weird. I can't seem to find the CS Monitor any more, whereas my health section gets flooded by marijuana news from what appear to be advocacy sites.

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#22

Post by Natsu »

fatalogic wrote: post #5

I just wish it was easier to find unbiased news. Just a list of facts no slant either way.

I hear you. I want more facts, less opinion, and a good list of verifiable sources out of my news. Suffice it to say, there's precious little of that to be found anywhere.

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#23

Post by fmoralesc »

RyanZAG wrote: post #3
vinhboy wrote: post #2

> It’s also not Zuckerberg’s responsibility to solve a broken business model in journalism. (One could argue he has a moral imperative to do so, given his position of power, but that’s not the same thing.) That line is pretty much all you need to know about the article, despite what the title is claiming. In my opinion. If anything is destroying journalism, it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact…

> In my opinion. If anything is destroying journalism, it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact vs fiction. Why is this a problem that needs to be solved though? A big part of being free is being able to choose what you get to care about, being able to choose what you get to read, and being able to have your own opinions. Remove that, and you're no longer free. Would it be better to not be a free p…

You get to choose what you care about, but you don't get to chose whether it is right to to care about it. You are free to have whatever opinion you want, but you don't get to choose whether those opinions are correct. This matters practically because the "tribunal of facts" stabilizes collective action: when responsive to it, people can count on certain strategies to solve problems. If you cease to care about what is fact, your strategies will inevitably get out of step with everyone else's. This is only sustainable until the facts force themselves on you.

Constraining your freedom doesn't mean you cease to be free, but it allows others to flourish just as you do. A free society ("a free people", as you say) should allow everyone to flourish as much as they care to (but no less). Collective freedom is not just the sum of individual freedoms. It is the result of cooperation.

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#24

Post by eropple »

RyanZAG wrote: post #3
vinhboy wrote: post #2

> It’s also not Zuckerberg’s responsibility to solve a broken business model in journalism. (One could argue he has a moral imperative to do so, given his position of power, but that’s not the same thing.) That line is pretty much all you need to know about the article, despite what the title is claiming. In my opinion. If anything is destroying journalism, it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact…

> In my opinion. If anything is destroying journalism, it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact vs fiction. Why is this a problem that needs to be solved though? A big part of being free is being able to choose what you get to care about, being able to choose what you get to read, and being able to have your own opinions. Remove that, and you're no longer free. Would it be better to not be a free p…

You can, and should, have your own opinions.

Does that extend to facts?

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#25

Post by kensai »

caisah wrote: post #13
vinhboy wrote: post #2

> It’s also not Zuckerberg’s responsibility to solve a broken business model in journalism. (One could argue he has a moral imperative to do so, given his position of power, but that’s not the same thing.) That line is pretty much all you need to know about the article, despite what the title is claiming. In my opinion. If anything is destroying journalism, it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact…

>it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact vs fiction. Sometimes is not that simple. A lot of this is related to personal biases and just the way the brain works. Ofcourse people can try to train theirselves into being more skeptic but in a world in which every day you are bombarded with information is pretty hard to find the time and motivation to do so.

Personal bias and brain tricks contributions are really blown out of proportions here. Most of the stuff that happens in the fact vs fiction is unfortunately of this aspect:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5d4yVP7sNA

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#26

Post by funkychicken »

WildUtah wrote: post #20
Animats wrote: post #18

Crowd-sourcing news quality does not work. There's no ground truth. Google News is suffering from this. I noted on Wikipedia today, in a discussion of reliable sources, that I had searched for info about a Wikipedia topic with Google news search, with terrible results. The top three results were Algemeiner (Jewish), Breitbart News (alt-right), and Mondoweiss ("progressive and anti-Zionist"). This is pathetic.

Those three are probably more reliably accurate than Atlantic, NYTimes, WaPo and the other old properties that have distinguished themselves only with lies and credulity in this century. Breitbart is now the third most read news source in America, so things are looking up.

.

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#28

Post by frik »

vinhboy wrote: post #2

> It’s also not Zuckerberg’s responsibility to solve a broken business model in journalism. (One could argue he has a moral imperative to do so, given his position of power, but that’s not the same thing.) That line is pretty much all you need to know about the article, despite what the title is claiming. In my opinion. If anything is destroying journalism, it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact…

What is destroying journalism is also relying too much on news sources like AP, Reuters, etc. Let's call it copy&paste news articles. They should do their homework and investigate on their own, that's their job description after all. We don't need these cheap media that just reprint propaganda-style sponsored stories.

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#29

Post by rjvir »

edblarney wrote: post #19
rjvir wrote: post #9

This chart ( https://twitter.com/benthompson/status/778260618914652164 ) suggests that Facebook should not a lone scapegoat for journalism's decline - the internet as a whole is a more reasonable target.

Possibly the 'sources' of information are 'all over the internet' - but the medium of virality is FB.

Maybe phrasing it another way could be useful: with or without Facebook, the journalism industry would be heavily declining.

Yes, Facebook is how many people use the Internet - but it's a mistake to therefore conclude Facebook is responsible for journalism's decline.

Re: The Mark Zuckerberg Manifesto Is a Blueprint for Destroying Journalism

#30

Post by aanm1988 »

frik wrote: post #28
vinhboy wrote: post #2

> It’s also not Zuckerberg’s responsibility to solve a broken business model in journalism. (One could argue he has a moral imperative to do so, given his position of power, but that’s not the same thing.) That line is pretty much all you need to know about the article, despite what the title is claiming. In my opinion. If anything is destroying journalism, it's the fact that half this country does not care for fact…

What is destroying journalism is also relying too much on news sources like AP, Reuters, etc. Let's call it copy&paste news articles. They should do their homework and investigate on their own, that's their job description after all. We don't need these cheap media that just reprint propaganda-style sponsored stories.

> We don't need these cheap media that just reprint propaganda-style sponsored stories.

What's destroying journalism is people like you calling out media as propaganda, fake news, etc...

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