15GHz? Jesus.
And 800 MHz bandwidth. I wonder what kind of bandwidth carriers will use in real life.
5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
41–50 of 73 posts
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#42Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wow so carriers have really built out their networks in Finland it sounds like. I think this is probably true of all the Nordics no? There are no caps on your 4G? I am curious are you using a mobile router? My experience with these has been that there were data caps attached to them and the plan, as opposed to a 4G unlimited plan on my phone.
I can't speak for Finland, but in Sweden I don't think there are any plans with unlimited data anymore, that weren't grandfathered. There used to be when 3G was the norm, but now that 4G is available pretty much everywhere you'll be capped most likely. My plan for instance is capped at 100gb I believe, for which I pay about 500-600 SEK / month. (This includes all domestic voice and texts too.)
Sigh. And in Norway the highest "off the shelf" cap is 200gb/month at ~800 NOK :/
I'm not clear what the providers think the future will be - even 200gb is a tight fit for streaming 1080p video, never mind 4k or 8k hdr.
Looks like they'll continue to drag their feet with fiber, and continue to spend on dsl while struggling to get people to commit to 4g (because at current price/datacap/coverage it doesn't really make sense).
Or maybe it's the electronics dealers that will take the hit because lossy 720p doesn't look any better on a 4/8k screen...
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#43These days with 4G i do find that it is not the technology that is the bottleneck. It is the carierers trying to hold on to their business model. I would prefer if we aimed our research on increasing coverage.
The technology is still a bottleneck, but the business model just isn't tightly fitted to the limitations of the bottle neck. 4G cannot viably stream 1080p netflix into the number of homes in America that use it at any given time (unless you use an unrealistic number of cell sites). Some sort of rationing has to occur otherwise cells would be overrun. Carriers should bring back free nights and weekends.
Free nights and weekends is exactly anti-net-neutrality.
I have always been an advocate for more, open, spectrum, and simple laws to outlaw intentional interference. We are not operating dumb radios - we can dynamically change or allocate spectrum channels to load balance congestion and avoid making it worse.
To legally cordon off everyone into separate silos is a hatchet solution to a nuanced problem with much better solutions if you could just incentivize good behavior and punish bad in commons.
I do not believe for a second we cannot technologically transfer h265 video via radio to every individual in even the highest population densities if we had full access to building infrastructure around all of the spectrum of light we use for communications.
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#44These days with 4G i do find that it is not the technology that is the bottleneck. It is the carierers trying to hold on to their business model. I would prefer if we aimed our research on increasing coverage.
Carriers do max out the capacity of many cell towers. Remember that it's you and dozens of other people (at least) concurrently downloading stuff over the same tower. Scarcity is a fact of life, and the bandwidth has to be allocated somehow.
I do wonder how it would work if we did some sort of high-speed dynamic bidding for bandwidth, rather than a constant fee. It could actually be very helpful; it would incentivize carriers to appropriately allocate bandwidth for an area (maximizing profit would coincide nicely with maximizing customer utility) and it would allow customers to directly "feel the pain" of bloated downloads and websites, leading to more market feedback for wasting bandwidth by making 8MB webpages or whatever.
Here's a really cool idea; no SIM card, no network attachment. Your phone uses some technology like Bitcoin micropayment channels (high-speed off-network secure micro payments, great protocol) to automatically buy bandwidth from whichever regional cell tower is offering you the best deal.
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#45I hope that the network vendors and the IoT vendors sit down and think about how the devices and the network can work to mitigate things like large-scale IoT DDoS etc. Even if this mean new protocoling or whatever. I'm not sure I'm thinking about this exactly correctly, but I feel there is something in there?
IoT vendors don't think, which is why the crap they sell is vulnerable to so much exploitation.
Network operators should know better than to put cell radios into devices you know will be compromised in a year or two.
Hell, the solution sounds pretty simple to me. Network attached devices must be openly disclosed with open source hardware and must have standardized wired update and control mechanisms. That way consumers can make intelligent decisions to buy products that can see long term support by their communities, because companies absolutely won't do it (and because they are international, you cannot really bind them to support terms of contracts - these negotiations have to happen at the import level, and nothing really stops them from dropping products a year down the road from support and bribing the right people / dissolving and reforming the company to circumvent consequences - but you can force them to disclose source and hardware architecture, enabling the consumers to maintain security themselves).
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#46Spectra efficiency and even faster data rates are nice but I wonder are carriers going going to upgrade backhaul link and IP core network to allow customers to take full advantage of 5G air interface? This a huge capex spending. I wonder if customers willing to pay even more exorbitant prices for 5G plans for their phone? With those speeds 5G could be an alternative/replacement for cable/DSL for home internet access.…
I use an LTE hotspot as my main access point in Belize, but I have to pay $5/GB for it. :( Edit: My hotspot tends to run at around 22Mb/sec, which is faster than the fastest DSL line you can get here, which is 16Mb and costs $400/mo.
My AT&T plan in the US is $6.66/GB for the first 30 and $15/GB after that. Just tested, I'm getting around 27Mb/s down.
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#47Earlier quoted context omitted.
The technology is still a bottleneck, but the business model just isn't tightly fitted to the limitations of the bottle neck. 4G cannot viably stream 1080p netflix into the number of homes in America that use it at any given time (unless you use an unrealistic number of cell sites). Some sort of rationing has to occur otherwise cells would be overrun. Carriers should bring back free nights and weekends.
Free nights and weekends is exactly anti-net-neutrality. I have always been an advocate for more, open, spectrum, and simple laws to outlaw intentional interference. We are not operating dumb radios - we can dynamically change or allocate spectrum channels to load balance congestion and avoid making it worse. To legally cordon off everyone into separate silos is a hatchet solution to a nuanced problem with much bette…
I can't think of a reason why free nights and weekends would be anti-net neutrality.
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#48> The 5G New Radio (NR) used 800MHz bandwidth, running on 15GHz
Wow, 15Ghz signals are going to really suck for building penetration...
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#49Earlier quoted context omitted.
I use an LTE hotspot as my main access point in Belize, but I have to pay $5/GB for it. :( Edit: My hotspot tends to run at around 22Mb/sec, which is faster than the fastest DSL line you can get here, which is 16Mb and costs $400/mo.
My AT&T plan in the US is $6.66/GB for the first 30 and $15/GB after that. Just tested, I'm getting around 27Mb/s down.
Geez, I thought Belize was bad! That is shocking since otherwise Belize is notorious for having some of the most expensive broadband internet access in the world (even though it has more backbone connections than Denmark).
Re: 5G Network end-to-end demonstration by Ericsson
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
The technology is still a bottleneck, but the business model just isn't tightly fitted to the limitations of the bottle neck. 4G cannot viably stream 1080p netflix into the number of homes in America that use it at any given time (unless you use an unrealistic number of cell sites). Some sort of rationing has to occur otherwise cells would be overrun. Carriers should bring back free nights and weekends.
Free nights and weekends is exactly anti-net-neutrality. I have always been an advocate for more, open, spectrum, and simple laws to outlaw intentional interference. We are not operating dumb radios - we can dynamically change or allocate spectrum channels to load balance congestion and avoid making it worse. To legally cordon off everyone into separate silos is a hatchet solution to a nuanced problem with much bette…
> To legally cordon off everyone into separate silos is a hatchet solution to a nuanced problem
I have a sneaking suspicion that it's been done this way so that it can be treated like "property" legally protected and commoditised as such.
The bottleneck here is the law, which as everyone knows "is an ass" (by which I mean in all seriousness it has difficulty dealing with such nuance)