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What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

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Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#161
post #134

I don't know any of my passwords except for my password manager. If I leave my password DB at home, and mail a physical copy to my destination, what can happen? I'll be absolutely unable to access any account.

Then you shouldn't expect to be let into any country. Take the flight back and return when you can actually unlock your phone.

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#162
post #3

Worth remembering: US citizens can play chicken with CBP and lose nothing more than their computer/phone hardware (perhaps having it returned 6 months later). But non-citizens, possibly including LPRs, cannot: if an alien attempts to cross the border with a device they can't unlock "because they don't have the corresponding 2FA token with them" (as one friend suggested they do), they'll be detained, their devices con…

--> The current best practice for border crossings --- really anywhere in the world --- is simply not to carry anything you're unwilling to unlock for Customs.

How do password managers play into this? I'm likely going to be traveling to the US on business. I'll be bringing a travel phone rather than a normal phone (This is my standard travel practice for any country). I could do the same with a computer.

I don't mind unlocking that. But passwords are a thornier issue. All of my passwords are stored in a password manager. On my computer, these are actually stored in a physical file, so if CBP cloned my hard drive they'd potentially have all my passwords. That would amount to ~400 passwords I'd need to change.

I could make a travel profile for my password manager and only bring in a limited, strictly necessary set of passwords.

But then this raises a further issue: do I keep social media passwords on that list, or leave them off? If I kept them off, I could honestly say "I can't login. I didn't want distracting social media on a business trip". But it might be safer just to have them? I could change the passwords after. I'm not sure of the risks of having CBP log into Facebook.

This is probably not a likely case I have to worry about, but I'd still like to figure out the best practice.

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CBP will begin asking everyone for Facebook logins. I don't understand how this doesn't run afoul of the Fourth Amendment. Surely one's social media qualifies as "papers" or "effects" even though they're digital artifacts and not physical. This just seems _incredibly_ invasive.

Silly things like laws and constitutions do not apply at the US border. Or anywhere near it. https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights-governments-100-mile-b...

oh, some laws definitely still apply! try lying to the border agent if you doubt it!

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#164

This happened to me crossing into Canada and to be honest I really wasn't expecting it. I had tons of very private pictures and messages on there stretching back years. I really didn't want to turn over my password so that 3 border agents could look through all that stuff in some back room, but at the same time I knew there wasn't anything illegal on there. Anyway, I was with my partner and didn't want to ruin her va…

Honestly -- do not lie to border agents. Do not do anything illegal or even with a smell of dishonesty while talking to agents on foreign soil, or even to agents of your own country.

Travel with a safe, clean device, if you travel with a device at all. If it is your employer's device, cooperate and then tell your employer's lawyers what happened.

Stay safe, especially if you're a minority of any kind.

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ugh. Canadian border crossings used to be so nice.

No, they were not.

I suspect that part of the reason here is a tit-for-tat.

The USA has a long history of being nasty to Canadians on the suspicion of them going there to work. Similar things happening to US visitors to Brazil and several other places.

Having a Dutch passport this never was a problem for me when returning to Canada, even though I was actually working there.

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your method also only works if you have a small social circle or don't go out much. Good luck planning a big party or trip without a Whatsapp/Telegram/Facebook group chat..

You understand that society did just fine for thousands of years without these things right? Maybe if you are 20 the social norms have changed so drastically that calling someone is unthinkable but I rather doubt that. Certainly for my generation and above ('84) it's not required.

We used to have to call[1] several people to organize a gathering/outing, in the distant past of 15 years ago. If someone wasn't home you just had to try again later and/or leave a message, which they would only hear when they got home. Maybe every now and then someone would miss something because of this, though not often. Shockingly, it worked just fine.

[1] from our homes, obviously, since that's where the phone is, unless you were one of the rare high school students carrying a cellphone that had a usable amount of minutes on it, and even then cell call quality was (is...) so crap that you'd prefer your home phone.

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#168
post #155
post #138

The question I have in mind is "do they have the right to confiscate your device or to disappear with it?". What if I told them "I'm going to unlock it, but I'm the driver. Ask me all that you want to see, and I'll take you to that app?".

What if they told you "we're going to detain you until you do what we want?"

If you're a citizen they cannot. A citizen cannot be refused entry.

They can keep your stuff, however. And if you're merely a permanent resident you can be refused entry.

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Happily, to counterbalance that, US jurisdiction is often assumed to cover the farthest reaches of the planet.

That's patently false. Good luck enforcing US business law in Norway.

Actually, I have had US business law thrown at me. It didn't stick, of course, but that was much to the throwers surprise, apparently.

But then, I'm not in Norway. I'm in Denmark :)

Re: What could happen if you refuse to unlock your phone at the US border?

#170
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated... Your phone is undoubtedly your "effects" (in 1789, touching your phone without your consent would have been a trespass to chattel). But searches incident to a border crossing have always been considered not "unreasonable," because inspecting the flow of things acro…

> But searches incident to a border crossing have always been considered not "unreasonable," because inspecting the flow of things across the border has always been seen as a legitimate government function. ... > So searches of digital content are at least outside one of the key purposes of the border search exception. Yes. And also, who in their right mind would use a phone and an airline ticket to smuggle at most 3…

I feel obligated to point out that:

1. my phone has a 200GB microSD card in it right now 2. 256GB microSD cards are readily available 3. phones with two microSD cards are available 4. I can easily purchase a 4TB hard drive that is roughly the same size as a pack of cards

It's not terribly relevant, but you're dramatically underestimating the volume of data that can be reasonably stored by media carried on one's person.

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