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India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

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Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#191

Post by Xylakant »

tallanvor wrote: post #179
droopyEyelids wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mylar chip bags and 20oz soda bottles... What a revolution for litter and health it'd be if we got rid of those, too.

Plastic bottles and cans really need to have a nationwide deposit system in the US - the way Norway does it helps a lot - they have either a 1 or 2.5kr deposit depending on the size of the bottle, and all the grocery stores have a machine that you feed them into that checks for the label and gives you a slip to get the money from the cashier. It'd be nice if we could find a way to extend that type of system to other…

deposit systems have a limited lifetime, the get killed by inflation. For example, glass beer bottles in GER have a deposit of 8 cent. This used to be 15 Pfennig, a pretty high amount when the deposit was introduced. But since you can't raise the deposit (bottles suddenly would raise in value) and inflation pushes down the purchasing power, even bottle collectors tend to leave glass bottles behind.

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#192

Post by [deleted] »

tallanvor wrote: post #179
droopyEyelids wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mylar chip bags and 20oz soda bottles... What a revolution for litter and health it'd be if we got rid of those, too.

Plastic bottles and cans really need to have a nationwide deposit system in the US - the way Norway does it helps a lot - they have either a 1 or 2.5kr deposit depending on the size of the bottle, and all the grocery stores have a machine that you feed them into that checks for the label and gives you a slip to get the money from the cashier. It'd be nice if we could find a way to extend that type of system to other…

[deleted]

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#193

Post by hollander »

greggman wrote: post #142
Kluny wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was this scene in Mad Men where Don Draper, Betty Draper and the kids go out for a picnic in the new family car. They eat lunch in a grassy field, then when they're done, they pack up their basket and blanket, leaving the beer cans, food wrappers, empty bottles, plastic cutlery, and chicken bones scattered on the grass. That scene shocked and horrified me more than all the sexism, racism, and homophobia combine…

That still happens in America. See pictures of Washington DC the day after 4th of July. Or Golden Gate Park in SF after a big festival. So many people leave their trash looks it like a dump. Compare to say Cherry Blossom watching in Japan where a large park will be entirely covered in people but when it's over they will have all cleaned it up. It's a cultural issue. I have no idea how to influence western cultures to…

With big festivals with thousands of people gathering in park or square, you can expect this in Europe. Problem is that you buy a drink in a plastic cup or bottle, maybe a sandwhich or fries with it, and you need to dispose of the plastic or paper. Where do you leave it? There simply are not enough trash cans around or nearby. In a big crowded place it's not easy to move around, you can get lost etc. So people throw their garbage on the ground. By the way, all available trash cans are full and have a pile load of garbage next to them. So even if they are full, people still use them to keep the trash together.

I don't see the problem here. Afterwards cleaners come and clean the square, streets, whatever. It's part of the game.

On normal days, people here keep the cities, parks and streets rather clean.

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#194

Post by megablast »

rtpg wrote: post #172
greggman wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That still happens in America. See pictures of Washington DC the day after 4th of July. Or Golden Gate Park in SF after a big festival. So many people leave their trash looks it like a dump. Compare to say Cherry Blossom watching in Japan where a large park will be entirely covered in people but when it's over they will have all cleaned it up. It's a cultural issue. I have no idea how to influence western cultures to…

Even in Cherry Blossom season, or at fireworks, there's random bits of trash that are flying around. Though they also make sure to make huuuuge trash cans for the events so that it's not a major pain to throw stuff away. Most people don't want to litter, after all. The main reason for the cleanliness afterwards are all the extra staff during those periods that go through and pick this stuff up.

> Though they also make sure to make huuuuge trash cans for the events so that it's not a major pain to throw stuff away.

I have never been to a festival where these were not full of rubbish to overflowing.

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#195

Post by megablast »

wavefunction wrote: post #39
WalterBright wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My father told me that American highways used to be lined with trash until it was made illegal to throw trash out the window.

I've been told this too. There was a massive anti-littering campaign in the 1950s called "Keep America Beautiful" and it was ironically initiated by the packaging industry[0]. [0] http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2006/05/origins-anti-litter-...

As disposable cans, cups, bottles, and other packaging became more widespread in the postwar years, so did litter, and some blamed the companies that manufactured them—in 1953, for example, Vermont passed a law banning the sale of beer in non-refillable bottles. Consequently, Coca-Cola, Pepsi, Seagram's, Procter and Gamble, Dupont, Dow, and others used their influence to found Keep America Beautiful.

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#196

Post by megablast »

Xylakant wrote: post #191
tallanvor wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plastic bottles and cans really need to have a nationwide deposit system in the US - the way Norway does it helps a lot - they have either a 1 or 2.5kr deposit depending on the size of the bottle, and all the grocery stores have a machine that you feed them into that checks for the label and gives you a slip to get the money from the cashier. It'd be nice if we could find a way to extend that type of system to other…

deposit systems have a limited lifetime, the get killed by inflation. For example, glass beer bottles in GER have a deposit of 8 cent. This used to be 15 Pfennig, a pretty high amount when the deposit was introduced. But since you can't raise the deposit (bottles suddenly would raise in value) and inflation pushes down the purchasing power, even bottle collectors tend to leave glass bottles behind.

You can raise it. South Australia recently raised it from 5c to 10c.

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#197

Post by 2muchcoffeeman »

hollander wrote: post #193
greggman wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That still happens in America. See pictures of Washington DC the day after 4th of July. Or Golden Gate Park in SF after a big festival. So many people leave their trash looks it like a dump. Compare to say Cherry Blossom watching in Japan where a large park will be entirely covered in people but when it's over they will have all cleaned it up. It's a cultural issue. I have no idea how to influence western cultures to…

With big festivals with thousands of people gathering in park or square, you can expect this in Europe. Problem is that you buy a drink in a plastic cup or bottle, maybe a sandwhich or fries with it, and you need to dispose of the plastic or paper. Where do you leave it? There simply are not enough trash cans around or nearby. In a big crowded place it's not easy to move around, you can get lost etc. So people throw…

Simple, carry the thrash until you find a non full trash can or dispose of it at home.

You're just making excuses for the lazy and inconsiderate.

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#198

Post by J-dawg »

all_usernames wrote: post #185
J-dawg wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is utterly bizarre. This stuff angers and confuses me in equal measure. It's like a complete refusal to participate in society, just the expectation that someone else will come and tidy up after you. How do these people behave elsewhere in their lives? One example I keep seeing is people who buy a pack of cigarettes, rip off the plastic film covering and just drop it on the floor. It sends me into a silent rage ev…

If you've spent your whole life feeling victimized by society then you do whatever little things you can to give a big middle finger back. If you're a Black single mom that has to work two jobs to get by, maybe it's easy for you to justify throwing your McDonald's wrappers on the parking lot ground.

This is an interesting way of looking at it. I wonder if this really is the psychology of people who do stuff like this.

If this is the case, it would be interesting to find out whether there is some correlation between wealth inequality and rates of littering.

Re: India has banned disposable plastic in Delhi

#199

Post by akamaozu »

hollander wrote: post #193
greggman wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That still happens in America. See pictures of Washington DC the day after 4th of July. Or Golden Gate Park in SF after a big festival. So many people leave their trash looks it like a dump. Compare to say Cherry Blossom watching in Japan where a large park will be entirely covered in people but when it's over they will have all cleaned it up. It's a cultural issue. I have no idea how to influence western cultures to…

With big festivals with thousands of people gathering in park or square, you can expect this in Europe. Problem is that you buy a drink in a plastic cup or bottle, maybe a sandwhich or fries with it, and you need to dispose of the plastic or paper. Where do you leave it? There simply are not enough trash cans around or nearby. In a big crowded place it's not easy to move around, you can get lost etc. So people throw…

> I don't see the problem here. Afterwards cleaners come and clean the square, streets, whatever. It's part of the game.

You think this is a game??

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