Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
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Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#52In that sense I think I have the same problem with this proof that I do with the standard one, where you add the Maclaurin series of cos(θ) and i * sin(θ) and match term-by-term with the series for e^(i * θ). The problem is, at the point you can actually show equality, the things on one side aren't obviously a rotation and the things on the other side aren't obviously an exponential.
I'm not just hear to yell at clouds. I was given a proof that I truly love by a professor I adore, which I think really does give insight into what all these operators are doing. The best video I can find with it is here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dhHrg-KbJ0 (Skip to 7:30 if you're already comfortable with the limit definition of e^x)
The basic summary is:
1) e^iθ is equal to (1 + iθ/n) ^ n for large n
2) That base, (1 + iθ/n), plotted as a complex number, has length approaching 1, angle approaching θ/n
3) The base squared, (1 + iθ/n)^2, by de moivre's theorem, forms another point as if the transformation from (0, 1) were repeated twice — that is, the length stays one, and another tiny angle is added for a total of 2θ/n
4) The full result is therefore n transformations, taking the path along the unit circle, traveling θ and arriving at cos(θ) + i * sin(θ)
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#53Is it pure chance that this was posted only two or three days after I watched it along with a few other e to pi = -1 videos? Randomness aside. 3blue1brown makes some wonderful math videos that I find really explain the intuitiveness of some of the ideas. I was unfortunately cursed with a math teacher who for whatever reason required us to memorize until we passed the test. Imaginary numbers were taught as "something…
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
Richard Feynman used to go up to people all the time and he'd say "You won't believe what happened to me today... you won't believe what happened to me" and people would say "What?" and he'd say "Absolutely nothing". I agree wholeheartedly with the quality assessment of 3blue1brown videos. All mathematics should be clear and intuitive, by definition :)
> All mathematics should be clear and intuitive, by definition :) I disagree with this completely, and so does all of higher mathematics. It's neither clear nor intuitive. In fact, as soon as you start learning about infinities (Calc I), intuition becomes hit and miss.
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
>It's entirely non-obvious WHY we should be okay with rotating all of a sudden. Why shouldn't we? We have a set of object called multipliers that we want to generalize to the 2 dimensional plane. The presented generalization (eg, the multiplier identified by x maps the point at 1 to the point at x) seems natural; and it defiantly seems to be well defined. Additionally, it appears obvious that the presented generaliza…
> Why shouldn't we? We have a set of object called multipliers that we want to generalize to the 2 dimensional plane. The presented generalization (eg, the multiplier identified by x maps the point at 1 to the point at x) seems natural Rotating all of a sudden does not feel natural to me at all . Why not start cutting up the 2D plane? Why not fold it? In analytic terms, we would cause discontinuities, whereas rotatin…
The quotient of two vectors v/u should be some kind of operator which transforms one into the other (that is, when you multiply it by one, you get the other, (v/u)u = v(u\u) = v, because we want multiplication to be associative). If those two vectors are the same length but different directions, the natural transformation to use is a rotation. The reason to use a rotation is that we want the transformation to make sense irrespective of any arbitrary coordinate system we decide to impose. If we used some kind of skew, it would break down under change of coordinates. As for reflections: if the quotient of two vectors was some kind of reflection, then we could square any quotient of vectors to get an identity transformation, which would not result in a very useful or consistent arithmetic.
The nicest and most useful formalism for defining multiplication of vectors is called geometric algebra, a.k.a. Clifford algebra. Start with http://geocalc.clas.asu.edu/pdf/OerstedMedalLecture.pdf
Or see the recent blog post http://www.shapeoperator.com/2016/12/12/sunset-geometry/
Or see more links at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12938727#12941658
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
>It's entirely non-obvious WHY we should be okay with rotating all of a sudden. Why shouldn't we? We have a set of object called multipliers that we want to generalize to the 2 dimensional plane. The presented generalization (eg, the multiplier identified by x maps the point at 1 to the point at x) seems natural; and it defiantly seems to be well defined. Additionally, it appears obvious that the presented generaliza…
> Why shouldn't we? We have a set of object called multipliers that we want to generalize to the 2 dimensional plane. The presented generalization (eg, the multiplier identified by x maps the point at 1 to the point at x) seems natural Rotating all of a sudden does not feel natural to me at all . Why not start cutting up the 2D plane? Why not fold it? In analytic terms, we would cause discontinuities, whereas rotatin…
It is not immediately obvious to me how skewing could define such an operation in the general case; or how flipping could define such an operation in most cases.
In any case, the system of adders and multipliers in 2-dimension he describes, even if not the only reasonable 2D generalization, is certainly a reasonable generalizaion, and one that has proved useful.
>It's actually at the heart of why rotation (and not some other geometric operation) is key to e^iπ.
In this video, e^x is defined as a mapping between multipliers and adders. Multipliers are defined to be a combination of rotation and scaling. Any relationship between exponential, calculus, infinite sums, etc is purely a result of these definitions (except, perhaps, the motivation for choicing i * pi to be the principle multiplier mapping that gets mapped to -1 under e.)
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#57This explanation strikes me as a little too aggressive in throwing out the notation with the bathwater, only reaching its result by redefining the terms we already have intuition for into space-stretching operations that don't work like arithmetic does in my head. In that sense I think I have the same problem with this proof that I do with the standard one, where you add the Maclaurin series of cos(θ) and i * sin(θ)…
Your text summary of the video is accurate and likely makes sense to some people but not so much for others (namely, me).
Tour words are hard to grok until you see the visual depiction --- until you see the sequence of n transformations become a spiral arrangement of triangles that ends up approximating the (-1, 0i) point in the complex plane.
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#58This explanation strikes me as a little too aggressive in throwing out the notation with the bathwater, only reaching its result by redefining the terms we already have intuition for into space-stretching operations that don't work like arithmetic does in my head. In that sense I think I have the same problem with this proof that I do with the standard one, where you add the Maclaurin series of cos(θ) and i * sin(θ)…
The primary motivation for the exponential function is to be the inverse of the logarithm function. And the motivation of logarithms is to convert multiplication problems to addition problems, so they could be solved with table lookups (later performed on a slide rule) instead of difficult arithmetic. That is, log ab = log a + log b. Which is to say, exp(c + d) = (exp c)(exp d). Just setting this constraint along with the derivative exp’ 0 = 1 is enough to characterize the exponential function.
Or you can get to this function in many other ways, e.g. by solving the differential equation d/dx exp x = exp x; by the series 1 + x + x^2/2 + x^3/6 + ...; or by defining the logarithm as the definite integral of 1/x starting at 1, and then taking the exponential function to be its inverse. I like defining the (complex) exponential as a conformal mapping between the cylinder and the plane minus a point.
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Why shouldn't we? We have a set of object called multipliers that we want to generalize to the 2 dimensional plane. The presented generalization (eg, the multiplier identified by x maps the point at 1 to the point at x) seems natural Rotating all of a sudden does not feel natural to me at all . Why not start cutting up the 2D plane? Why not fold it? In analytic terms, we would cause discontinuities, whereas rotatin…
We want some operation that maps the point 1 to the point x, while holding the origin constant. I agree that scale and rotate is not the only such function, but when I personally visualize taking a grid and moving one point while keeping another constant, that is what I visualize. Additionally, this has the added property of maintaining the grid structure. It is not immediately obvious to me how skewing could define…
True, my point was only that the definition obscures the fact that rotation (and specifically the stunning relationship between trigonometry and exponential functions) is the key to the answer of "why". Without that, I think the video is just an exercise in indirection.
Re: Why does e to pi i equal -1? (2015) [video]
#60I've seen this a while ago, and while it's pretty instructive, it's actually also pretty confusing. The magic happens in a seemingly-innocuous throwaway sentence at around 4:20 (after being introduced to the 2D plane): > ... This can now include rotating along with some stretching and shrinking ... It's entirely non-obvious WHY we should be okay with rotating all of a sudden. The real answer is not super complicated,…
as a masters in mathematics, this is exactly what i came here to write. thanks! To have a notion that multiplication by imaginaries causes rotation, you'd need Euler's formula. I honestly think the best way to get a visual sense for why multiplication by r exp(i theta) is to look at the first few terms of the taylor series added together and see that the adders combine into a spiral that converges on r cos(theta) + i…
No you don't. You might notice this by simply working with imaginary numbers. You might invent imaginary numbers for rotation [0].
Alternatively, consider the multiplication (x + yi)(a + bi), as the value (a + bi) performing a transformation on (x + yi). We want (x + yi)(a + bi) = xy - by + ayi + bxi. If we consider (x + yi) to be a 2 dimensional matrix (with basis 1 and i), we can write the above equation as a matrix multiplication:
[ x y ] [ a b ] = [ ax-by ; ay + bx]
-b a
Notice that [ a b ]
-b a
is just a rotation matrix multiplied by the scalar (a^2 + b^2).[0] That is, define a group (in the group-theory sense) of functions of rotations, denoted as xi for real numbers x, and a group of group of functions for sliding, denoted x for real numbers x. You might then notice that you can combine these groups in a field structure, that happens to have 1i * 1i = -1, and that the subfield of elements with no i component happens to be isomorphic the the reals.