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Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

blog.evernote.com

111–120 of 144 posts

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#111
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? At list prices? Pretty much never. Nobody sane with installations like Evernote are paying remotely close to the published prices, though. The cloud providers rarely make sense in terms of cost for smaller businesses unless you heavily rely on batch jobs (spinning servers up/down) or other of their more advanced services. There are many val…

"> but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? At list prices? Pretty much never. " ??? It's almost always 'cheaper' for small companies to use the cloud. It costs a lot of money to pay people to figure what hardware to buy, install servers, networking gear, maintain it, pay for bandwidth, backup etc. But the cost becomes 'non starter' when you start to access all the nice things that…

> It costs a lot of money to pay people to figure what hardware to buy, install servers, networking gear, maintain it, pay for bandwidth, backup etc.

> Then of course there are the financing aspects: you don't pay for expensive servers up front, you 'lease' them effectively - which has serious working capital benefits.

There are solutions other than cloud and going to the extreme of owning servers, switches, maintenance, bandwidth and space in a datacenter.

OVH (an example due to my familiarity) will sell you a dedicated server with 2 x E5 2650v3, 256GB of RAM, 4TB of disk and 500Mbit guaranteed bandwidth (1Gbps burst) for $269/mo. This includes most of the annoying stuff, like replacing failed components, dealing with network issues and such. The bandwidth, conveniently, is also not limited aside from the speed you're given. You can use 500Mbit/s for every second of a month if you want. That's 164TB.

The cost of a n1-highmem-32, which is the closest alternative I could find on GCE is $1030/mo, plus disk ($348/mo for 2TB), plus bandwidth (164TB is $13k from Google).

Also, the cost of owning and running your own hardware isn't necessarily expensive, particularly if you're small. When you're running a fleet of thousands, yes, you definitely want dedicated people for that. When you can fit all your infrastructure in a single rack, it's not much trouble to call up Dell and ask for a quote, install it in a local DC then forget about it. Most DCs give you "remote" or "smart" hands that can do basic maintenance like swapping a failed HDD for low or no cost.

Dedicated/colocation aren't for everyone but they're certainly not as scary as some people around here seem to think. And in terms of cost, I daresay that if you're doing anything bandwidth heavy, the cloud is near-certainly costing you insane amounts of money. You can get decent gigabit transit (~300TB/mo) these days for $400/mo while Google, Amazon etc. charge in the thousands for that kind of traffic.

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#112
post #16

I can understand that a company wants to do away with the distraction of having to worry about running a datacentre but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? Amazon and Microsoft seem to be making healthy profits off their cloud services. That's part of your cost. Now it may be that even if more expensive, it is a better use of your capital (renting instead of owning so that you can…

I think economy of scale will kick in at some point allowing the cloud providers to profit while being a cheaper service than what the clients could have done themselves.

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#113
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should look at CloudHQ. Their PDF backups to e.g. Google Drive preserve everything out of Evernote. Used it once to get away from Evernote while still preserving search of old stuff.

Thanks. I don't want to get away from Evernote though.

You can also do continuous backups there.

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#114
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? At list prices? Pretty much never. Nobody sane with installations like Evernote are paying remotely close to the published prices, though. The cloud providers rarely make sense in terms of cost for smaller businesses unless you heavily rely on batch jobs (spinning servers up/down) or other of their more advanced services. There are many val…

"> but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? At list prices? Pretty much never. " ??? It's almost always 'cheaper' for small companies to use the cloud. It costs a lot of money to pay people to figure what hardware to buy, install servers, networking gear, maintain it, pay for bandwidth, backup etc. But the cost becomes 'non starter' when you start to access all the nice things that…

And for many big and successful companies that don't use the cloud, the only reason is because cloud didn't exist when they built their services.

If you're starting from scratch today, cloud is a no brainer.

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard this burst-to-cloud story for many years now - Paul Maritz pitched it heavily as the pillar of VMware's value/strategy when he took over there. I've yet to ever see or hear of it properly executed in practice. I think it's a really hard thing to try and bolt on to a legacy system, and if you build a new ground-up app this way going full cloud to start is easy and cheap for a while until you're successful a…

> I've yet to ever see or hear of it properly executed in practice. Isn't Netflix the poster child for this, and haven't they been for a very long time now? Not the content, which resides in their and others CDNs, but the back-end, webservers, databases and management systems are all supposed to be in the cloud now (after a long time migrating). > I think it's a really hard thing to try and bolt on to a legacy system…

Netflix is not a good example for one big reason: their cost of running servers is dwarfed by their other costs, possibly by two orders of magnitude. Netflix can and does waste money on servers.

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#117
post #16

I can understand that a company wants to do away with the distraction of having to worry about running a datacentre but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? Amazon and Microsoft seem to be making healthy profits off their cloud services. That's part of your cost. Now it may be that even if more expensive, it is a better use of your capital (renting instead of owning so that you can…

It is cheaper for my company. We have very high seasonal demand on one of our websites. Our busy months need 10 times as many servers as the low months. With amazon we pay for the servers only when we use them. When we did it ourselves the servers spent most of the year idle, but using electricity and maintenance but earning us nothing just so we could handle out peak demand. Now we pay nothing for them when we are not using them.

December is one of our low months: those servers we were hitting hard in September are now helping some online store keep up with the Christmas rush. I believe this is factored into the price we pay.

We do a lot of our own work in house. In general we have enough IT staff that it is more cost effective to keep our own servers in house, but that is for loads where the variation is relatively small.

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#118
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google runs its own CDN.

I think Youtube is still using Akamai but not as much anymore and Google's CDN is in beta last I checked. Google partners with other major CDN's also. https://www.quora.com/What-CDN-does-YouTube-use https://cloud.google.com/interconnect/cdn-interconnect

CDN Interconnect isn't the same as Cloud CDN (sorry, the names aren't great).

Cloud CDN itself (https://cloud.google.com/cdn) has been GA for a while, but support for reaching GCS directly from our Load Balancer (https://cloud.google.com/compute/docs/load-balancing/http/us...) and therefore CDN support is in Beta.

Disclosure: I work on Google Cloud.

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#119
post #5

Sadly the article never describes HOW they transfer the data. Simply sending 3PB on the wire will cost a fortune. Maybe Google does have some non-public service like AWS Snowball?

3PB over a fast, peered connection isn't unreasonable (and again, this would all be ingress to GCS which we don't charge for, but your provider would). The limiting factor would be how much you want to attack your storage layer at home.

Disclosure: I work on Google Cloud (but wasn't involved in this migration, nor even particularly aware).

Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform

#120
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing against the author, but it sounds like another story that Google PR pitched and influenced. It is normal these days. I am sure AWS does the same. That is why the technical details may be light. The submitter is likely a Social Media Manager for Google (nothing wrong with that - kudos for not obscuring it!) I, too, have wondered about the technical details when I see stories like this. If the data was original…

Hi! Author here. (Nice to meet you.) I can tell you that Evernote, not Google, pitched this story to me. While the Google Cloud PR team was aware of its existence, they did not contact or attempt to influence me when it came to its content. (Literally, all that they did was confirm the on-site presence of their engineers, and that an engagement of that sort wasn't a one-off favor to Evernote.) Unfortunately, a techni…

Thank you for your response and adding clarity around how the story came to be. You must forgive us if we are inherently suspicious.
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