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Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

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Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#371

Post by jordigh »

sandGorgon wrote: post #116

This post today is what is wrong with open source software. If someone knows jwe, then they should tell him that lots of corporates and startups WANT to support stuff like this. But you cannot give a paypal link and expect donations. As a company, I cant do that. I need an invoice. Hell, if you can get a business account, I daresay you will get subscriptions. I like to call this "gratitude-ware". Check out Sidekiq Pr…

I know jwe.

So, you want Octave to sell support contracts because accounting will never do donations. The two examples aren't selling just stooge licenses. In the case of pfsense, they're selling support. That means changing what jwe is doing from developing Octave to handling support calls. In the case of sidekiq, they're actually just selling plain ol' non-free software, which is what open-core is.

jwe will never want to sell non-free software. He's already selling some support and has a few customers, but it's not easy.

I often have heard engineers (who seem to sound angry or offended with the concept of a donation) say things like what you are saying, but I've never figured out how to satisfy them without either (1) just plain selling non-free software or (2) completely changing the focus of the work from developing Octave to doing some mind-numbingly boring task like getting Octave to run on RHEL 5.

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#372

Post by gregwebs »

EdiX wrote: post #303

Free startup idea: Patreon for Open Source * Users signs up to OSPatreon, downloads OSPatreon app that creates ospatreon directory in $HOME/.local/share/ or other operating system appropriate location, then creates a cronjob (or whatever) to rerun after one month * Open Source projects that want in add a snippet of code that, when the application closes, writes the amount of time the application ran to $HOME/.local/s…

This is a good idea. However, I think it is problematic that most open source usage is in the form of libraries. If a GUI leverages amazing open-source libraries, only the GUI author would be paid. Additionally, many closed source (GUI or not) projects leverage many open-source libraries.

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#373

Post by scrollaway »

ghaff wrote: post #364
scrollaway wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe there is a single OSI or common license that makes it straightforward for an author to say "This has all the open source freedoms, except for commercial uses" and sell the exception. When I see people asking if they can do this, they get laughed out of the room by others who claim that "open source freedoms" does not restrict commercial use. This is kind of a serious issue. Artists get such a license,…

>I don't believe there is a single OSI or common license that makes it straightforward for an author to say "This has all the open source freedoms, except for commercial uses" and sell the exception. That's true and I'll argue that's a feature not a bug. It's also by design. The OSI specifically does not allow "for educational use only" and other types of usage discrimination. "The license must not restrict anyone fr…

I understand and I can even agree to some extent, but this leaves developers in the dust.

I long for a world in which someone can make a living out of open source work, similarly to those making a living out of games, mobile apps, youtube videos etc, without having to either work at a company or creating extremely restrictively-licensed software.

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#374

Post by kbenson »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #238
kbenson wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it's 5% + processor fees. The 5% is purely Patreon's cut, but personally I think it's well worth it for a lot of people. I know there's at least few hundred dollars of my money in various people's accounts over the last couple years that wouldn't be there without Patreon.

Would you prefer Patreon if their rate was 3%?

I think you misread my comment, since I already prefer Patreon.

I wasn't making some obtuse statement about how money from me was being skimmed, I was commenting how the way they eased the friction of donating has caused me to done monthly to a lot more projects than I normally would, and that's added up over the years to a few hundred dollars of mine making its way to the accounts of people or groups whose services I use or works I consume, and that's a good thing.

Would I be happier if Patreon took a smaller cut? I guess. I don't see 5% at the low-level donations as very significant, given the platform Patreon supplies. Maybe it would be better if they changed to a 4% fee if you were getting over $500/mo in donations, and to 3% if you were getting over $2000/mo. Then again, when you start making that much per month, chances are Patreon is likely working out very well for you, and that 5% might be seen as well worth it?

In the end, as a consumer, it doesn't really matter to me. I'm bullish on the model of Patreon, and I think Patreon seems to execute fairly well on that model from what I can tell. I wouldn't mind if a few producers used Gratipay and I set that up too. I can deal with maybe 2-3 donation aggregators, I just don't want to deal with 10+ individual donation systems.

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#375

Post by ghaff »

scrollaway wrote: post #373
ghaff wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I don't believe there is a single OSI or common license that makes it straightforward for an author to say "This has all the open source freedoms, except for commercial uses" and sell the exception. That's true and I'll argue that's a feature not a bug. It's also by design. The OSI specifically does not allow "for educational use only" and other types of usage discrimination. "The license must not restrict anyone fr…

I understand and I can even agree to some extent, but this leaves developers in the dust. I long for a world in which someone can make a living out of open source work, similarly to those making a living out of games, mobile apps, youtube videos etc, without having to either work at a company or creating extremely restrictively-licensed software.

>making a living out of games, mobile apps, youtube videos

And very few indie game/mobile developers or would-be YouTube stars make a decent living out of it either however they license or sell their work. Same for most writers, independent consultants, etc. Being a freelancer is hard and doubly so when you're selling things that aren't necessities and have a lot of competition.

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#376

Post by seagreen »

astrodust wrote: post #183
seagreen wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then Linux happened, then scripting languages like Perl, Python and PHP proved themselves capable of getting the job done, and the modern web came about. This would never, ever have happened without those tools. So Linux was so good . . . that it enabled a world where normal people don't use it, but instead use JS apps that store information on other people's servers? Because that's what I hear when you say Linux i…

Normal people use Android phones. Which use Linux. Normal people use shared hosting. Which often uses Linux. Normal people use Linux a lot more than they realize. I think it's fine they don't have to pay attention to that, that computers can be invisible that way, but if you call yourself someone familiar with technology you can't be ignorant to it. So do you have an argument or just a whole lot of misplaced anger?

I have a lot of accurately placed anger.

Linux is great for experts, and I really respect it for that. It has been very empowering to people like us.

The web is a peasantizing TV replacement and a trash fire. Linux is great on its own merits, not because it enabled this "web" abomination.

(Talking about webapps here, not web sites. Your personal static site is awesome. The fact that many people's experience with computers is remotely delivered JS storing data places they don't control is not.)

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#377

Post by spangry »

plinkplonk wrote: post #120

You might want to check with the Julia folks. They now have a company (Julia Computing) backing the project. I don't know if they are hiring right now, and if so, whether you'd be a good fit, but it couldn't hurt to ask. Might be a better alternative to working for MathWorks! Julia is an open source project with many brilliant developers and mathematicians contributing. http://juliacomputing.com/ I don't see a 'jobs'…

This is great (and practical) advice. I hope the Octave BDFL reads it. Continuum Analytics might be another good fit, given a decent amount of ML work coming out of academia is in the form of a matlab file.

I'm not sure if by 'partner' they mean 'people we give money/people who give us money', but it costs nothing to ask: https://www.continuum.io/partners

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#378

Post by brilliantcode »

rabidrat wrote: post #152
brilliantcode wrote: post #139

> I would love to continue as the Octave BDFL but I also need to find a way to pay the bills. Breaks my heart to see such devoted developers having so much trouble paying bills for the work they've done. I truly believe that this problem can be solved-by crowdfunding open source developments that rivals commercial status quo, we can decouple ourselves from restrictive licensing structures while paying people's bills…

The "Subscribe to Updates" button on that page doesn't work. Also, above the "Full Name" field, it says "invalid".

subscription form works without issues my end. yeah that button is messed up. looking at you launchrock....

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#379

Post by [deleted] »

wolfgke wrote: post #274
briandear wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that is a pretty great idea.. essentially a private tax system to pay open source. However like all tax systems, it would only work if there were an enforcement mechanism. I do find it ironic that many of the dev crowd seem to love government taxes yet when it comes down to actually putting money into the products (code,) they depend on, people seem to get free-ridery all the sudden. Yet people have no proble…

> I do find it ironic that many of the dev crowd seem to love government taxes Can you provide evidence for that?

[deleted]

Re: Looking for Work After 25 Years of Octave

#380

Post by brilliantcode »

JoelJacobson wrote: post #239
brilliantcode wrote: post #139

> I would love to continue as the Octave BDFL but I also need to find a way to pay the bills. Breaks my heart to see such devoted developers having so much trouble paying bills for the work they've done. I truly believe that this problem can be solved-by crowdfunding open source developments that rivals commercial status quo, we can decouple ourselves from restrictive licensing structures while paying people's bills…

LetsOpenSource sounds like a brilliant idea! I have some ideas I want to love to discuss with you. Please contact me at joel at trustly dot com.

Just sent you an email!
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