Live data from Hacker News

Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

youtube.com

11–20 of 66 posts

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#11
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is because in your whole post you fail to raise any significant point. It just a bit of hand-waving about the US being better than the Chinese. It just oozes American Exceptionalism without any substance.

Ok then: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1165416/Chinas-hi-te...

Are you arguing Chinese death sentences are less humane than US ones?

A pretty weak point to make.

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#12
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is because in your whole post you fail to raise any significant point. It just a bit of hand-waving about the US being better than the Chinese. It just oozes American Exceptionalism without any substance.

Ok then: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1165416/Chinas-hi-te...

Just related to the source, but today in the news was that Wikipedia no longer accepts the daily mail as a valid source.

The thing in it may or may not be true.

First result searching for daily mail Wikipedia: https://www.engadget.com/2017/02/09/wikipedia-bans-daily-mai...

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok then: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1165416/Chinas-hi-te...

Are you arguing Chinese death sentences are less humane than US ones? A pretty weak point to make.

I am saying that a government that gets accused on a regular basis of things from religious discrimination to organ trading, on occasion even by credible sources, is unlikely to be better than the US government.

Most Chinese people I work with would agree with that too. They left China, they know why, and they're mostly not looking to get back.

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok then: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1165416/Chinas-hi-te...

Just related to the source, but today in the news was that Wikipedia no longer accepts the daily mail as a valid source. The thing in it may or may not be true. First result searching for daily mail Wikipedia: https://www.engadget.com/2017/02/09/wikipedia-bans-daily-mai...

To be honest the piece reads as Godwin's Law disguised as an article so I am not surprised.

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#15

I find this fascinating and troubling. From a hacker perspective it is incredible. On the other hand, this is all driven by a profoundly illiberal government that has no goals other than its own survival and that's supported by a lot of human misery, some might say slavery. I love using Apple products but it's hard to forget the conditions at places like Foxconn. Both sides think they are outflanking the other - the…

How do you think the conditions would be without Foxconn? I don't think the West could get a better deal from China than they are already getting. If the Chinese got their act totally together, wouldn't your Iphone get a lot more expensive? I don't think the west really wants to liberalize its trading partners as much as you think they do.

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#16
Great documentary.

One of the most interesting types of innovation which has come out of Shenzen is within production. Some of these companies literally started creating cheap knockoffs smartphone batteries and is now delivering superior batteries for ex large car manufactorers in ways European companies simply can't compete with.

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#17

I find this fascinating and troubling. From a hacker perspective it is incredible. On the other hand, this is all driven by a profoundly illiberal government that has no goals other than its own survival and that's supported by a lot of human misery, some might say slavery. I love using Apple products but it's hard to forget the conditions at places like Foxconn. Both sides think they are outflanking the other - the…

>profoundly illiberal government that has no goals other than its own survival and that's supported by a lot of human misery,

This is common misconception. China is authoritarian country but it's not a totalitarian dictatorship. Chinese government actually has problems of controlling it's population and people are not afraid to show their displeasure with protest and riots when things are wrong.

Politically modern China is very much like United Kingdom before universal suffrage. Communist party (60 million members) is very much like the noble class in UK. This upper class is full aware that they can't rule with iron fist. They have to deliver better conditions for people and manage industrialization and urbanization or their days are numbered. They have also tied their existence to Chinese (= Han) unity and nationalism (dangerously so, Taiwan is existential question for the communist party).

Economically modern China is very much like UK during industrialization. People in China are more at the mercy of crony capitalism and smog than the government.

Hopefully China will go trough similar set of gradual reforms. Maybe communists end up in the Chinese House of Lords where communist party still has little power.

----

>it's hard to forget the conditions at places like Foxconn.

People in the developing world move to cities to escape malnutrition. They are not forced to work in Foxconn, they choose to work in Foxconn in exchange of enough nutrition. If you want to see bad conditions, visit rural China and India where people still suffer from malnutrition. Malnutrition in China has dropped dramatically, thanks for hose horrible factory jobs. India has it much worse.

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#18
For every nation that desires to improve it's lot in life, there is a transition period. You must bridge the gap from the ultra suck, to more suck than normal, on to the good life. There are a very finite number of ways to bridge those gaps. Industry is one that is tried and proven.

It's easy to call a peoples way to move up in the world bad, its much harder to suggest a real world viable alternative path. I'm ok with China becoming the worlds best manufacturers of many things, and the cheapest manufacturers of other things.

I am unaware of another path that they could have taken, or could take right now, that would get them as much GDP or even better citizen outcomes, except for perhaps spreading the wealth downstream a bit more?

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#19

I find this fascinating and troubling. From a hacker perspective it is incredible. On the other hand, this is all driven by a profoundly illiberal government that has no goals other than its own survival and that's supported by a lot of human misery, some might say slavery. I love using Apple products but it's hard to forget the conditions at places like Foxconn. Both sides think they are outflanking the other - the…

>profoundly illiberal government that has no goals other than its own survival and that's supported by a lot of human misery, This is common misconception. China is authoritarian country but it's not a totalitarian dictatorship. Chinese government actually has problems of controlling it's population and people are not afraid to show their displeasure with protest and riots when things are wrong. Politically modern Ch…

exactly there are something like 13000 large riots in China a year.

Re: Shenzhen: The Silicon Valley of Hardware [video] (2016)

#20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you arguing Chinese death sentences are less humane than US ones? A pretty weak point to make.

I am saying that a government that gets accused on a regular basis of things from religious discrimination to organ trading, on occasion even by credible sources, is unlikely to be better than the US government. Most Chinese people I work with would agree with that too. They left China, they know why, and they're mostly not looking to get back.

The only differing aspect I see is this: the Chinese primarily mistreat their own citizens. The US primarily mistreat whoever opposes their interests.

The latter actually affects me, being a non-US citizen.

Post reply on HN