Sadly the article never describes HOW they transfer the data. Simply sending 3PB on the wire will cost a fortune. Maybe Google does have some non-public service like AWS Snowball?
The Evernote engineering team posted a five part blog post [1] that goes deep on the detail of the migration and work to maintain consistency. TLDR: Shard at a time was replicated over the network, then live traffic was cut over to the Google Cloud replica. [1] https://blog.evernote.com/tech/2017/02/08/part-1-evernote-se...
Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
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Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#32I can understand that a company wants to do away with the distraction of having to worry about running a datacentre but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? Amazon and Microsoft seem to be making healthy profits off their cloud services. That's part of your cost. Now it may be that even if more expensive, it is a better use of your capital (renting instead of owning so that you can…
For me the questions come down to the proportion of resources to revenue and how "cloud-ready" you are.
Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#33Guess Evernote are prepping for a sale/IPO? Moving into the cloud at this stage doesn't make any sense otherwise.
Why would it not make any sense? They probably did an analysis on this and decided that GCP overall is a better solution to their problem. I regularly move companies to the cloud because they cannot afford to setup their on services and just want to focus on the business side of tech and write software only that delivers business value. These companies tend to use queue services, CDNs, scalable file stores, clustered…
Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#34I can understand that a company wants to do away with the distraction of having to worry about running a datacentre but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? Amazon and Microsoft seem to be making healthy profits off their cloud services. That's part of your cost. Now it may be that even if more expensive, it is a better use of your capital (renting instead of owning so that you can…
But if you are interested in Big Data Analytics as well (as Evernote would be) then it is a bargain. It is very expensive to run your own managed Hadoop cluster, build the data ingestion and scheduling components, event store, NoSQL store, machine/deep learning pipelines not to mention AI technologies and have them all integrated and cohesively packaged.
Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#35Running a datacenter is still a hard problem to solve. Evernote just realised that.
If they started today I imagine they wouldn't have dreamed of having their own datacenters.
Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#36I can understand that a company wants to do away with the distraction of having to worry about running a datacentre but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? Amazon and Microsoft seem to be making healthy profits off their cloud services. That's part of your cost. Now it may be that even if more expensive, it is a better use of your capital (renting instead of owning so that you can…
First of all it is important to understand that building/running your own cloud isn't only huge investment and high risk but also comes high cost of opportunity because every cent you spend in infrastructure you hope will be cheaper is not spend to increase the real value of your product. Not making this investment until your organisation and IT are "cloud-ready" decreases this risk. I have seen companies invest more…
This is of interest to me because no matter how I slice it, when analyzed from this "baseline feature" perspective, cloud solutions of conventional software that require deploying upon conventional platforms are expensive, and I figure I must be missing the picture. I'm much more excited about cloud solutions like AWS Lambda that de novo solutions are built around, as those do seem to have more promise delivering the much-talked-about 2-10X cost improvements compared to conventional software, but still at a high cost of vendor lock-in due to lack of cloud API standards adoption by vendors.
Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#37Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#38I can understand that a company wants to do away with the distraction of having to worry about running a datacentre but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? Amazon and Microsoft seem to be making healthy profits off their cloud services. That's part of your cost. Now it may be that even if more expensive, it is a better use of your capital (renting instead of owning so that you can…
> is using one of the major cloud services cheaper
> than running your own?
Depends on the size and to some extent the distribution. Above a certain size (and this varies based on the mix of memory, storage, and CPU cycles) it is cheaper to run your own stuff in a space leased from a data center. However that size generally has to be achieved at every data center you want to run in. For example, if your function was that it saves money above size 10, And you need 7 units in the US and 7 units in Europe, it is probably not cost effective to run your own even though your up to 14 units of capacity, but if you're running 15(US) and 12(EU).That said, you still have to have the the operational expertise to run it and with that expertise will come an understanding of the actual costs. For example, at Blekko we were running 1500 machines in a data center and had just over 12,000 hard drives. Those drives are going to fail over time so you need build process around continually renewing the drives. You assume that you'll be able to get some replaced under warranty but you should also simply depreciate the cost of drives over 3 years. So you spend $110 on a drive, you depreciate it at cents per day. That is an "expense" you incur as you buy replacement drives. So your storage is "costing" you $36,000/month ($0.10 * 12,000 drives * 30 days). At the time it was the 2TB generation and our system used simple triple replication for data protection so it represented 8PB of data protected storage, of which, at any given time we were utilizing roughly 5PB. S3 from Amazon [1] is .021/GB per month so 5 petabytes (just what we were using) would be $105,000 per month (so roughly triple the cost). And there is the network 'in/out' costs which raise the prices further and you don't pay for your own storage. Most of our storage management costs (detecting bad drives, reformatting, scheduling for RMA) was done automatically but it did take an data center engineer one day each weak to work through the list of drives that had been determined to be bad, swap in replacements from the 'incoming' drive box, and put the outgoing into the 'rma' box (40 drives in the box) and once the outgoing box was full, print out the list of serial numbers and generate a standardized RMA to Western Digital and to then put the shipping label on the box. So in addition to the depreciation cost you add 20% of the cost of a date center engineer who is doing the mechanical work of moving dead drives out.
So you can cost it out this way for your own infrastructure and figure out which is cheaper, and for a lot of people it will be cheaper to run it in the cloud because you really don't need multiple petabytes of data or thousands of cores on line or terabytes of RAM. And some people build their systems in efficiently so that they are spending way more on people keeping them running than they might if they had designed them differently. glindahl had honed a set of scripts and tweaked Nagios bits that made running lots of machines fairly efficient but not everyone has someone like that on staff.
But the place where it is a real win, and I think this was the economic story that got Evernote to move, is that when you downsize your infrastructure needs it is trivial when you are in the cloud, and it is non-trivial when they are your own assets. Data center leases are generally multi-year and they are loath to let you sublet space or reduce space.
Since Evernote has been shrinking this makes a lot of sense for them, when their user base shrinks their costs shrink with it. And that is the "killer app" for cloud based infrastructure.
Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#39Nice Google ad, well done! > Evernote wanted to take advantage of the cloud Evernote _is_ part of the cloud. Buzzzz > Evernote houses a large amount of unstructured data, and the company is looking to do more with machine learning. Meaning private data? Is this covered in the TOS? Can I influence the usage of my data by Google before migration?
Your question is right on the mark. The last attempted privacy policy change, less than two months ago, did cause some reactions:
"The latest update to the Privacy Policy allows some Evernote employees to exercise oversight of machine learning technologies applied to account content"
https://techcrunch.com/2016/12/14/evernotes-new-privacy-poli...
"The policy changes have to do with machine learning, which Evernote says it is using to “help you get the most out of your Evernote experience.” Evernote wants to let its machine learning algorithms crunch your data, but it doesn’t want to stop there — the company also wants to let some of its employees read your notes so it can ensure that the machine learning is functioning properly."
Also:
Re: Evernote’s transition to Google Cloud Platform
#40I can understand that a company wants to do away with the distraction of having to worry about running a datacentre but is using one of the major cloud services cheaper than running your own? Amazon and Microsoft seem to be making healthy profits off their cloud services. That's part of your cost. Now it may be that even if more expensive, it is a better use of your capital (renting instead of owning so that you can…
If all you are using Amazon/Microsoft for is EC2 style hosting then yes it's expensive. But if you are interested in Big Data Analytics as well (as Evernote would be) then it is a bargain. It is very expensive to run your own managed Hadoop cluster, build the data ingestion and scheduling components, event store, NoSQL store, machine/deep learning pipelines not to mention AI technologies and have them all integrated…
They seem to call it "machine learning" "to help you get the most out of your Evernote experience."
https://techcrunch.com/2016/12/14/evernotes-new-privacy-poli...
As one author once wrote "Whenever a company says 'In order to serve you better', you can be pretty sure they're about to do something that will make your life more miserable." I like the point of xkcd 1150 too. But Evernote actually does take money from their note taking customers.