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The web sucks if you have a slow connection

danluu.com

51–60 of 622 posts

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#51
post #16

> Why shouldn’t the web work with dialup or a dialup-like connection? Because we have the capability to work beyond that capacity now in most cases. That's like asking "why shouldn't we allow horses on our highways?" > Pretty much everything I consume online is plain text, even if it happens to be styled with images and fancy javascript. No doubt, pretty much everyone who works on web apps for long enough understands…

The web is becoming a platform delivery service for complex applications.

No, it's not. Yes, there are MMORPGs that run in the browser using WebGL.[1] But very, very few pages use all that capability. Most web pages today would work just fine in HTML 3.1.

And what is this thing with running over ten trackers on one page?

[1] http://www.webglgames.com/

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#52

Did most of the web suck when we were on 28k or 56k modems? I'd argue that it didn't, and yet even with the light weight of pages back then, it was incredibly slower than today's pages (even heavy ones) load over our much-faster connections. So really, I think what the author is observing is that having experienced high-speed reliable connections , it is very disappointing to move to a much slower connection. For the…

> Did most of the web suck when we were on 28k or 56k modems?

Yes, lots of the early web sucked over dialup.

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#53

Wow, really? Who knew overuse of JS and fancy graphical effects where they're not needed could negatively impact user experience? Could it be that all the web devs using 20 CDNs, cramming 900 frameworks, 100 externally provided analytics, advertisement providers and fancy layout eye-candy were wrong all along? What a surprise! I'm already sick when I have to visit a webpage and it won't even load ANYTHING if I don't…

Many younger devs may have never lived outside of large, very-well connected cities (NY, Chicago, West Coast, etc.). They may assume that everyone has the connectivity and speeds that they do, or in the least they may not fully understand with 1.5 Mbps down really feels like.

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#55

Wow, really? Who knew overuse of JS and fancy graphical effects where they're not needed could negatively impact user experience? Could it be that all the web devs using 20 CDNs, cramming 900 frameworks, 100 externally provided analytics, advertisement providers and fancy layout eye-candy were wrong all along? What a surprise! I'm already sick when I have to visit a webpage and it won't even load ANYTHING if I don't…

reminds me of node-noop

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#56
Looking at that first table, one question jumps out at me: what the heck is Jeff Atwood doing on pages at Coding Horror that makes them weigh 23MB?

I mean, I'm all for avoiding premature optimizations, but 23MB for one page is just... wow.

EDIT: As a sanity check, I just tried loading the CH home page from a cold cache myself. Total weight: 31.26MB. Yowch.

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#57
post #39

Something that sticks out looking at the table. How can some sites simply FAIL loading? I mean, there is something inherently wrong with our web today, where if my internet is very slow and _could_ load a page in 80 seconds if I just leave it like that, the server itself could have configured the timeout to be 60 seconds. So I can never load the page?! The assumption is here that both points of the connection is base…

He mentions packet loss of 10%. That's a different problem than a slow connection.

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Wow, really? Who knew overuse of JS and fancy graphical effects where they're not needed could negatively impact user experience? Clearly not enough people, because it keeps happening. I think it would also help if people kept in mind that the internet is global, it isn't just for developed nations.

It's not a matter of whether the internet is global, its who your audience is... if you audience is primarily in developed nations, then the rest of the world isn't much of an issue.

"Why hasn't the campaign hired anyone to make phone calls?"

"Bill, phone calls are so 1992, they hired a web dev to create online polls"

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#59
> Pages are often designed so that they’re hard or impossible to read if some dependency fails to load. On a slow connection, it’s quite common for at least one depedency to fail. After refreshing the page twice, the page loaded as it was supposed to and I was able to read the blog post, a fairly compelling post on eliminating dependencies.

slow clap

His data on steve-yegge.blogspot.com is particularly unfortunate: Steve's (excellent) posts are almost completely pure text, and there's no reason for them to fail to download or display, except that Google demands that one execute JavaScript in order to get a readable page.

> if you’re browsing from Mauritania, Madagascar, or Vanuatu, loading codinghorror once will cost you more than 10% of the daily per capita GNI.

Maybe the social-justice angle can convince some people to shed their megabytes of JavaScript and embrace clean, simple, static pages? There's probably some kid in rural Ethiopia who might have been inspired to create great things, if only he'd been able to read Steve Yegge's blog.

> The “ludicrously fast” guide fails to display properly on dialup or slow mobile connections because the images time out.

slow clap

> Since its publication, the “ludicrously fast” guide was updated with some javascript that only loads images if you scroll down far enough.

Incidentally, is there any way we can enforce the death penalty against people who load images with JavaScript? HTML already has a way to load images in a page: it's the element. I shouldn't be required to hand code execution privileges over to any random site on the Internet in order to view text or images.

Re: The web sucks if you have a slow connection

#60
post #39

Something that sticks out looking at the table. How can some sites simply FAIL loading? I mean, there is something inherently wrong with our web today, where if my internet is very slow and _could_ load a page in 80 seconds if I just leave it like that, the server itself could have configured the timeout to be 60 seconds. So I can never load the page?! The assumption is here that both points of the connection is base…

>how will stuff even remotely work when we are a interplanetary

We won't be and aliens have better internet anyway :)

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