The amount of money they made from that data is probably orders of magnitude more than the paltry $2.2 million penalty. I hate to get all paranoid, but it seems like every day there's news of a company's data being hacked, and what information isn't being hacked is being actively sold. What can an average citizen do (short of living Ron Swanson-style in a cabin in the woods) to protect their privacy?
Build a blacklist of companies that adopt such policies and boycott the shit out of them.
What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
281–290 of 340 posts
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#282Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have a "smart" LG TV - it's slow and a few years old. I manage to avoid LG's tracking of me by not having the Ethernet cable plugged in... I suppose you could just buy a new smart TV and not inform it of its WiFi details.
From what I've read, some smart TVs actually require you to connect them to the internet for them to work at all.
Does like everything stop working without internet now? ...sigh
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#283Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is why i torrent behind a VPN despite being subscribed to HBO now, Netflix, and Amazon Video. My guilt is ameliorated and at least a sliver of ny privacy is maintained.
I thought Netflix and related services work the same way Spotify does: they pay content providers a small fee based on actual content viewing. If you pay Netflix a monthly subscription but never view any content on your account, I would assume Netflix keeps all of the revenue and doesn't pay out anything to the actual content providers. Just a guess, but it's possible your plan is backfiring by paying the company you…
http://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/062515/how-ne...
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#284Huge schocker /s Pretty sure that Samsung does very similar things. I've been interested in actually capturing outgoing pcap data for this purpose. Looks like I have a new project to add the pile.
Why do you think Samsung is doing this as well?
"Interest Based Advertisement. Samsung provides the ability to obtain and view interactive and interest based advertising on your Smart TV. Interest based advertisements will rely on your TV viewing history and Smart TV usage information. Your viewing history includes information about the networks, channels, and programs viewed on your Smart TV and the amount of time spent viewing them. We may use automatic content recognition (ACR) and other technologies to capture this information."
It is opt-out, and it's buried a couple levels deep in the menus.
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#285Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah not much of a punishment to discourage further abuse. Should have fined them on a ratio of the number of data points they collected (100 billion). Even a 100:1 seems like a reasonable punishment for this scale of abuse ($1 billion)
The idea that the data that they collected was worth $1B is laughable.
Expected return from 'illegal' activity E = R - p * F, where R is revenue, F is fine and p is probability of getting caught.
p < 1, so if F < R engaging in such activity is a rational, if immoral, choice.
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#286Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you want a high end tv you don't have much choice. But also, why do you not expect your Roku / apple tv / etc to be watching you?
You could buy a high end Digital Signage display. Usually these are "dumb" and also have no TV tuner or consumer type settings. But are high quality, designed to be powered on 24 hours a day and have great picture quality. Because of the lack of additional image processing, they often have some of the lowest input lag as well. http://www.samsung.com/us/business/displays/digital-signage/ Prices are much higher though.
Not that much higher ... maybe double ?
Remember, the digital signage displays are often used in arrays of 12 or 18 or 24 displays, so they have to be somewhat cost-competitive - otherwise an airport or hotel lobby or mall couldn't stitch 24 of them together.
I always chime in on these discussions to urge folks to buy a digital signage / commercial display (probably from NEC). Not only are they as dumb as dumb gets, but they are also very, very high performance displays.
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#287It's not worth buying any of these 'Smart' TVs. I don't know whether it is a shoddy developer experience provided by the likes of Samsung / Vizeo etc or if it's the developers themselves (Hulu I'm looking at you) who do not maintain their apps which are constantly bug filled. I much prefer my old dumb TV that has a Roku plugged into it. Oh yeah, and I know it's not WATCHING ME.
I got my dad a Roku but he didn't want it so I took it thinking I would return it but for Netflix and YouTube it's far faster than the same Samsung apps.
My plan to build a Pi 3 media box was set aside for now.
But yes wow such crap and mind games in these smart TVs when all I want is to see my video signal!
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#288Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thanks for posting this. When I saw the original FTC story I recalled reading about this once or twice in the past but couldn't think of any key phrases or sources. In response to some of the other comments here, basically what they are guilty of isn't spying but failing to properly disclose and opt-in users. There is a particular major AV vendor who is selling raw clickstream data of millions of their user's interne…
Is it possible to bring about a similar complaint against Facebook with the FTC? Or, if the FTC is the wrong agency, what would be the right one? Of particular concern are "shadow profiles" - dossiers on people who have never even used or consented to using Facebook[1]. I'm no lawyer, but there could be precedent per this Vizio case. In my opinion Facebook is hugely overstepping people's privacy bounds, even if they…
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#289Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is it possible to bring about a similar complaint against Facebook with the FTC? Or, if the FTC is the wrong agency, what would be the right one? Of particular concern are "shadow profiles" - dossiers on people who have never even used or consented to using Facebook[1]. I'm no lawyer, but there could be precedent per this Vizio case. In my opinion Facebook is hugely overstepping people's privacy bounds, even if they…
By using FB, you consent to them using the information about you that others and you yourself provide. Dont like it? Dont use FB.
I think you misread the comment. These are people that already don't use Facebook.
Re: What Vizio was doing behind the TV screen
#290The ACR technology that cognitive used was/is in vizio and LG tvs. during the time I worked there we only had a deal to use it actively on vizio tvs. I guess lg was just testing the waters to see how it'd work. The ACR technology that CG used is based on RGB values from sampled patches on regions of the image. There was no audio finger printing used. There were a number of items that would mess up the "recognition". Some of those included aspect ratio of content, watermarks from different providers, overlays and basically anything that modified either the size of the original image or obstructed it. For the server infrastructure, what we did was we ingested live feeds from the major network providers, these feeds had to be ahead of what tvs were watching by at least 5-10 seconds so we actually had the fingerprint data in our database to be recognized. we would pair the ingested fingerprints to TV scheduling data and voila, we "knew" what you were watching. Now clearly if we didn't have the content in our database we had no idea what was being shown on your screen.
What did we use the ACR data for. Well there were 2 "deals" going on while I was there. One was ratings, something to compete with the likes of neilsons. Different content providers, distributors, marketing agencies, etc. would want ratings info. Additional there were other "data mining" companies that build profiles based off public IP addresses that would want to use our data to enhance and augment their data. The other application that was the one that everybody was after want "interactive advertising". This would allow us to pop up an HTML5 app/page based on the ACR. So for example your selling a car, your ad comes up, you pop up your app and allow the user to schedule a test drive or look at the car in more detail. The use cases were endless though.
The ACR technology ONLY worked on content that was viewed from the HDMI ports. Any built in apps like netflix or hulu that were run, ACR was force disabled. One thing I remember about that was that netflix is huge about NOBODY getting viewing data/ratings information about netflix and it's users. Only netflix has that data apparently. One somewhat reassuring thing about disabling the technology is at one point vizio did notice a bug on one of its TVs where ACR was not being disabled when the user opted out of "interactivity". This was a big deal and we were required to solve it ASAP.
AMA if I missed something.