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Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

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51–60 of 104 posts

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#51
post #40
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a whole lot of facebook accounts that I don't have ID to match.

It violates the Facebook ToS to have an account with a name that doesn't match your ID.

Right, but how could anyone prove that you are the one who created the fake account?

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#52
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It violates the Facebook ToS to have an account with a name that doesn't match your ID.

Right, but how could anyone prove that you are the one who created the fake account?

They could look at your phone or computer and see which Facebook account you are logged into. This won't prove you created it but even logging into it is possibly a ToS violation.

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#53
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing? Facebook is not a passport, you can be called whoever you want on it.

If you have a false facebook account, you broke facebooks ToS! That means you accessed facebooks servers without authentication!! That is a crime under e.g. the CFAA!!! Criminals go to jail. That is the argument at least.

You'd have had to lie to Customs and Border Protection, which is already probably a crime and quite likely sufficient to get you detained and deported.

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#54
post #26
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how do you prove that i have a fake facebook account? obviously i would have to log-out on my mobile and laptop

If you don't have identification that matches the name of your Facebook account.

but how would they find this "name of your facebook account"? yes they will have my ID, real name, finger prints, etc. but how would they figure out that I am using facebook account "puppy123"? And even if they would suspect it somehow (someone would report it), I can simply deny and there is no evidence that I am in fact owner of that account. or what am i missing?

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#55

Isn't it nice if ToS is legally binding? 1. Make a website and write somewhere in the middle of ToS that visitor must pay $1000 (for example) for every page viewed or for every second spent on a site 2. Persuade him to press "I have read and agree to the ToS" and to stay as long as possible 3. Send a bill

Then at what point does something become binding on the Internet? Most of my financial work over the last year has involved e-signed contracts. I typed my name and the date, certifying I had read and understand the contract - the difference between that and certifying that I've read the ToS via a checkbox seems arbitrary.

In EU this would be treated as a shrink wrap EULA. Those are generally not considered binding.

Click wrap is different and some may be considered binding.

(Caveat: IANAL)

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#56
post #54
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't have identification that matches the name of your Facebook account.

but how would they find this "name of your facebook account"? yes they will have my ID, real name, finger prints, etc. but how would they figure out that I am using facebook account "puppy123"? And even if they would suspect it somehow (someone would report it), I can simply deny and there is no evidence that I am in fact owner of that account. or what am i missing?

If you're logged into it on your phone/computer, it's evidence that you created the account. Or else you logged into someone else's account which is also a ToS violation.

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#57
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if placing a cookie on my computer without prior written consent constitutes "unauthorized access". Class action anyone?

In Britain it's illegal for a website to store a cookie without informing you, so I have a feeling someone may have already tried this.

Likewise in EU.

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#58
post #46
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only mentions I can find refer to "support materials" for assisting clients - That could broadly mean everything from documentation to firmware (which they hold on to tightly with cold, dead hands). Rimini's website seems to suggest they were probably accessing everything. The fact that they were making money off it - and ignored a request to stop - is probably the main difference between this and going after ope…

Shouldn't that be an issue of copyright then?

It should. (depending on the copyright licence) Or a civil lawsuit vs breach of contract.

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#59
post #56
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but how would they find this "name of your facebook account"? yes they will have my ID, real name, finger prints, etc. but how would they figure out that I am using facebook account "puppy123"? And even if they would suspect it somehow (someone would report it), I can simply deny and there is no evidence that I am in fact owner of that account. or what am i missing?

If you're logged into it on your phone/computer, it's evidence that you created the account. Or else you logged into someone else's account which is also a ToS violation.

thats why i wrote in my first comment: "obviously i would have to log-out on my mobile and laptop"

Re: Violating Terms of Use Isn’t a Crime, EFF Tells Court

#60
post #43

Popular websites should add an Oracle employee clause to their ToS so that employees of Oracle corporation are not allowed to use it.

even more interesting case:

Recent case law has mostly struck down the CFAA criminal penalties for violating TOS. But case law generally imposes a higher obligation on employees to comply with authorized use agreements that they've signed.

If you concretely enumerate the authorized uses of employee access and leave out subpoenas, the first time you're served with a FISA letter you can keep the court busy for weeks pending a ruling on the CFAA consequences.

This will never work long term and it will certainly piss off some judges & FBI agents, but at least it can further defang the overzealous authorized use language in the CFAA.

The fact that the FBI (or whoever drafted the natl security letter) is inducing you to commit a felony may also trump the gag order. But YMMV with that argument. Even if you win that one on appeal you'll spend some time in jail in the interim.

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