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What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

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Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#152
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Put Unity Ubuntu on that same machine, and it's unusable garbage. I can't even hit alt-F5 to get to another terminal because Unity slows the whole rig down to an absolute crawl. Like, can't even move the mouse, 5 minutes between keypress and action taking place. Fuck Unity. I blame Unity about 40% for killing the Linux desktop. Have you tried Xubuntu? It fills the gap that Ubuntu used to, and it's my go-to desktop…

XFCE: lightweight and powerful That's my choice as well

Good thing about XFCE is that xrdp still works when you need it.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#153
post #6

I think it was the inability for GUI's to stay stable. Gnome went off the rails, Unity completely ruined Ubuntu[1], and KDE always felt very cheap and hard to navigate. My opinion, yes, but I always felt the GUI changes in Linux were extremely gratuitous after Gnome 2. Couple this with the fact that for a decade, the actual GUI was tied very, very heavily to the apps. So you had to use Gedit in Gnome, or whatever the…

I just bought a sub-$300 laptop, which was unusable with the default Windows OS. It's snappy with Ubuntu/unity.

I don't think very many people care about running 2001 laptops anymore.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#154
I don't remember the details, but I do recall being flabbergasted that the latest KDE couldn't run the eclipse IDE properly. Dialogs were missing entire fields. It seemed so odd that made me doubt myself and check the same dialog on OS X to be sure.

Something to do about Gnome overhauling its style system to use CSS, which affected some other library in KDE that implements SWT via some gnome library, or ... gah who even cares.

The teams in charge of the linux desktops environments seem to behave as if backwards compatibility was no big deal.

Say what you will about Microsoft, but they do make an effort maintain backwards compatibility with some truly ancient applications.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#155
post #6

I think it was the inability for GUI's to stay stable. Gnome went off the rails, Unity completely ruined Ubuntu[1], and KDE always felt very cheap and hard to navigate. My opinion, yes, but I always felt the GUI changes in Linux were extremely gratuitous after Gnome 2. Couple this with the fact that for a decade, the actual GUI was tied very, very heavily to the apps. So you had to use Gedit in Gnome, or whatever the…

Can someone please explain to me why everyone says that Gnome went off the rails? Gnome 3 to me was, except for leaving behind a lot of legacy systems, an extremely usable and downright pretty UI. Menu, search, windows, and virtual desktops all available from one keypress or one hotspot. I thought that was a stroke of genius myself.

I too am totally in love with gnome shell. Guess people just hate on new workflows because szre it takes a few hours to adapt

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#156
I quote from the article: "To sum up: (a) First dimension: things change too quickly, breaking both open source and proprietary software alike; (b) incompatibility across Linux distributions"

I must say, this is the type of thing I have been talking about for years. Linux has always had its evangelists and champions in the Server community (I would reckon Red Het, Ubuntu, and Debian/Slackware are the root of what what upended Unix servers in the 2000s, but that is for another day at another time to get in-depth).

Yet, there was no foundation, no company, no project, until maybe in the last year or two with elementary OS and some of the standardizations coming out of the Fedora project, that you even see some evangelism in the Linux desktop space (let alone mobile. I am not counting android). The problem as I see it is Linux is the programmers playground - which is great! - but what that also turns out to be is that since you can fork, edit, re-create, spin, and otherwise modify the code as we programmers see fit, you get no level of standardization, no harmonized quality control on fundamentals, no one evangelizing the Linux Desktop as a platform that you can make apps for (which I still contend is a big issue for Linux as a Desktop for the even semi-mainstream user. I think most developers not withstanding.) It was never an inclusive platform

Some might say this was the point. They don't want, nor do we need Linux to be the same as macOS, or Windows. Perhaps the point of the communities that sprang up around the Linux on the desktop movements is that there is a ethos that having these fundamentals is bad, or that evangelizing a platform is 'selling out'. I've seen this argument many times over the years. To me, the quote from the article above, sums it all up nicely. The platform never had any fundamental evangelists pushing for a harmonized Linux experience. There is always Chaos, sometimes a little (nvidia driver breaks again because of a point update) or a lot (Well, today we have no GUI because Gnome moved to Wayland and for some reason my distro has some component it doesn't support yet so when it went to apply the update it failed).

Until idealism stops running the show and there is some consolidation in the fundamentals of Linux on mobile and Linux on the desktop, neither will be a way forward if you value access to the latest software, consistency in the fundamentals, stability, and out of the box hardware support from manufacturers.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#157
post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Before you complain about that, consider that every GNU/Linux nerd has strong feelings about their preferred GNU/Linux distribution (or version (such as LTS, Stable, Bleeding Edge etc.). So they will probably not be satisfied with the distribution that is installed and install their preferred one Those who have such preferences, have zero problems installing their own distro. The fact that it doesn't come pre-insta…

> as long as they aren't forced to pay the nasty Windows tax. It is much simpler just not to ship any OS to customers that want to avoid the Microsoft tax (indeed some vendors sell PCs without any installed OS - in particular for enterprise customers; I also). This has the advantage that they don't have to provide support to customers that are using the installed GNU/Linux distribution. But note that avoiding the "Mi…

Its not about the amount. Its a more idealistic value (for me at least) i simply dont want windows and will buy the worse hardware for more money even if i can avoid owning windows.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#158
post #147
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If XP was secure, performant on modern hardware, stable and supported by new programs i would still be using it. More then that the reason i quit windows98 was that warcraft 3 doesn't work on it. Windows 7 configuration menus are god awful and windows10 ones are far worse then that. You are making a fallacy in saying that old equals bad/ugly. XFCE is keeping it oldschool and can still look amazing (xubuntu looks grea…

Honestly gnome shell is the greatest thing ever. My focus and productivity skyrocketet. I see how people who would prefer to run XP dont like it. But no reason to make it bad.

My productivity went up when i stopped arguing about DEs online. It is currently taking a dip, though.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#159

For me the question is a bit to the side of the article. If Adobe or any independent developer were releasing a Linux desktop app today, what would they target?

Debian and later rpm. Most other distros will pick one of both and build a build process around it. Not perfect butnthe way it works.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#160
post #159

For me the question is a bit to the side of the article. If Adobe or any independent developer were releasing a Linux desktop app today, what would they target?

Debian and later rpm. Most other distros will pick one of both and build a build process around it. Not perfect butnthe way it works.

What UI? [edit]Also, what type of process goes into converting a binary shipped by someone like Adobe? We are talking just changing the package format to install the binaries correctly, right?[/edit]
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