I find it an interesting comparison with the "I want to quit my job" feeling.
Except I'm stonewalling myself because I know the unhappiness is in my head and that with a change of opinion it wouldn't exist anymore.
Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
51–60 of 118 posts
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#52May 2010 follow-up interview to this 2009 essay by Laura Munson from the Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2010/may/08/laura-mun... Laura Munson's new book: http://www.amazon.com/This-Not-Story-You-Think/dp/0399156658...
I think the Guardian article was especially insightful because Munson reveals an important reason why her husband "turned around":
"His sister got cancer and her husband had just left her and she had five children and she actually died last 4 July."
I know why his brother-in-law left his sister, but this event might make him more hesitant about leaving his own wife.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#53I'd like to make a thoughtful comment, but I'm struggling to get past the phrase 'age-appropriate'. As someone who has never been 'appropriate' to their chronological age in any respect, it always comes across as reductive, patronising and ultimately dehumanising. It seems to me to be the product of a worldview which sees children not as distinctive individuals with unique preferences and aptitudes, but as mere larva…
As you predicted, I do think you're being unfair to her. Relationships and happiness are tricky things -- if happiness does not come from externalities, can you not control your own thoughts, construct your own internal reality, and be happy based on that? Likewise, aren't relationships defined by feelings, not external successes, so dealing with the other person in _any_ capacity defines the relationship, and therefore its success?
I oversimplify, but it's something to think about.
More to the point, what I read was a woman who heard a line influenced by society, and decided she wanted to deal with it in a way that would force her husband to decide whether he really meant that. My feelings are rarely so clearly defined that I can reduced them to a few sentences, and I'll often collapse them to a saying because it's accurate enough. Frustration is one of the hardest to pin down, and I don't think it's unreasonable of her to say, "I hear that you're unhappy, but I don't think I'm the cause." Of course, just saying this isn't productive, for exactly the reason you mentioned: you can't tell somebody "You're wrong" when they express their feelings.
So she did what she could -- she distanced herself from the turmoil, and she tried to let her husband figure out exactly what the problem was. If it truly was their marriage, he would grow distance, and the subsequent departure would be easier on him. My guess, which fits with the events, is that he found the distance didn't quell his frustration, and re-engaging with his family at his own pace actually brought him some happiness.
Relationships are so close to our emotional core that when something goes wrong, it shows up in them. Like failing at work will make us unhappy even after we go home, lacking fulfillment from our hobbies and career can appear to show up in a relationship. Good relationships recognize this, and can survive an event like the one described in the article.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#54I like to call it a "midlife adjustment" and there is not a person alive who gets to that age who does not have to deal with it at some level - it really is the transitioning from the phase of life where everything points up to that in-between phase where things slow down, age starts to show itself more, and our mortality looms nearer. We all react to it differently but react we do, unless we are beyond feeling. This…
I think it's a bit of a stretch to state "not a person alive who gets to that age..." - The whole mid-life crisis thing is a function of societies that are a little higher up in Mazlo's hierarchy. I assure you that the significant part of humanity that is trying to track down enough food, clean water, or even a warm place to sleep each night - let alone adequate medical care or education, doesn't suffer from ennui. T…
(Maslow’s.)
Yes, very true, and perhaps a great illustration of how we humans haven’t yet evolved quite enough to deal with the very different challenges the affluent nations deal with so soon after we as a species were struggling for survival.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#55I'd like to make a thoughtful comment, but I'm struggling to get past the phrase 'age-appropriate'. As someone who has never been 'appropriate' to their chronological age in any respect, it always comes across as reductive, patronising and ultimately dehumanising. It seems to me to be the product of a worldview which sees children not as distinctive individuals with unique preferences and aptitudes, but as mere larva…
I suspect that we are ALL reading our own perspectives into this story quite a bit, so I can't say that you're wrong. Where you see "refusing to engage with him emotionally", I see her simply declining to respond to his drama with counter-drama of her own. She had an insight that let her avoid bringing her own ego into his situation, thereby simplifying the path to a resolution.
As an aside, as someone who had a parent who made their own happiness into an ever-present concern for their children, I agree vehemently with the notion that it isn't age-appropriate to do that.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#56I'd like to make a thoughtful comment, but I'm struggling to get past the phrase 'age-appropriate'. As someone who has never been 'appropriate' to their chronological age in any respect, it always comes across as reductive, patronising and ultimately dehumanising. It seems to me to be the product of a worldview which sees children not as distinctive individuals with unique preferences and aptitudes, but as mere larva…
"I'd like to make a thoughtful comment, but I'm struggling to get past the phrase 'age-appropriate'. As someone who has never been 'appropriate' to their chronological age in any respect, it always comes across as reductive, patronising and ultimately dehumanising. It seems to me to be the product of a worldview which sees children not as distinctive individuals with unique preferences and aptitudes, but as mere larvae passing through 'developmental stages'. I consider it an affront to the dignity of all children and my teeth are set on edge every time I hear it."
Do you have kids? Do you think a 4-year-old has "unique preferences" or feels de-humanized because he isn't given "ice cream" as a choice for dinner?
While your comment might be true of an adolescent, it is not true of all children as a category. There are very real and beneficial reasons for age-appropriate learning and guidance.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#57I'd like to make a thoughtful comment, but I'm struggling to get past the phrase 'age-appropriate'. As someone who has never been 'appropriate' to their chronological age in any respect, it always comes across as reductive, patronising and ultimately dehumanising. It seems to me to be the product of a worldview which sees children not as distinctive individuals with unique preferences and aptitudes, but as mere larva…
I don't believe the man in this story had any idea what he wanted apart from escape, escape from her, his kids, his job, perhaps his mortality. He could be described as a victim of his emotions. I think she was right to identify this as negative, as hopelessness and directionless self destruction. That doesn't make it any less real for him or any less painful for everyone involved but it does make it possible to see her as a patient and dedicated support. We all go through trials. Sometimes those trials work to destroy our lives, relationships and the people we love. We would all be lucky to have someone stick around while we take them for grant and self-immolate for 6 months.
Regardless, he always had the option to leave. If he had a better plan, he'd have rolled with it. If he was self-actualizing greater destiny, I would agree with you but this guy sounds like he was under water.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#58I'd like to make a thoughtful comment, but I'm struggling to get past the phrase 'age-appropriate'. As someone who has never been 'appropriate' to their chronological age in any respect, it always comes across as reductive, patronising and ultimately dehumanising. It seems to me to be the product of a worldview which sees children not as distinctive individuals with unique preferences and aptitudes, but as mere larva…
I think in this context "I don't buy it" is closer to "I think you are misinterpreting your feelings" rather than invalidation.
With respect to her emotional distance, John Gray's book: "Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus" has some good insight re Men's need for space and distance when things go bad. I think her actions were very sensible for a long term relationship.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#59I'm not going to comment on the lady - but there's one thing I wish; to hear the other side of the story.
Re: Those Aren’t Fighting Words, Dear
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
my guess: (s)he loves , but all the (wo)men (s)he dates hates and if (s)he married that (wo)man (s)he'd have to give up . Replace with the tag of your choice :) (^ one of the biggest crimes of political correctness: making everything so damn hard to read and full of strange punctuation!) Either that, or (s)he is typically extremely busy with very fulfilling things, and is looking for either a similar partner or a par…
I've run into that dating. The conversation was along the lines of... "So, it's paid off since I bought it with cash. The insurance is cheaper than an economy car. The parts are as cheap as economy cars, save for wear parts. It actually gets pretty decent mileage to boot. Why would I have to get rid of it?" "You just would, that's why!" I had hung out with her for two weeks and apparently her idea of a happy marriage…
> apparently her idea of a happy marriage was giving up everything I have, selling all my furniture, and buying whatever she fancied
Of course! That's how it works. You're just there to provide her money and status, nothing else. [/sarcastic frustration with some women]