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Incorporating a limited company in Germany

thomas.skowron.biz

11–20 of 113 posts

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#11
Estonia, simple forms, simple tax system (even a layman can understand it and can do their own taxes or small biz taxes). No need to visit to open a company or bank account if you have an e-resident card. E-residency cards are available to citizens of most nations.

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#12
post #11

Estonia, simple forms, simple tax system (even a layman can understand it and can do their own taxes or small biz taxes). No need to visit to open a company or bank account if you have an e-resident card. E-residency cards are available to citizens of most nations.

The only way for Estonia to get rich :-) keep it up!

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#13
post #6

Infinitely easier in the UK: you don't need capital, the forms are simple, it costs virtually nothing and you'll be done in less than a day. https://www.gov.uk/limited-company-formation/register-your-c...

There is/was quite some founding tourism from EU countries with more complicated laws to the UK. I wonder how the Brexit will affect them.

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#15
Don't worry, your government representative has some good ideas to improve the startup landscape and internet companies! You'll get a 40% corporate tax deduction for the first 4 years if you crowdfund.

There are, of course, specific conditions and regulatory work for the crowdfunding agency which mean no existing one (that anyone here has ever heard of) meets the bar and will essentially require a local operation to be set up. One of the biggest local banks (who probably pushed for the legislation?) meets the bar, though.

What do you mean, your potential backers want to use existing platforms they know? I'm sorry but can you ask those Kickstarter guys to file paperwork in our country (which they have never heard of either)?

If that's not an option, there' also the possibility to issue bonds. Bondholders won't have to pay the 30% tax on the bond's dividend if you start paying them out.

Lastly, it should be noted that all of the above benefits are forfeit if the crowdfunding campaign sends any backers' rewards.

I wish I'd make this up, but it was signed into law 3 days ago.

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#17
The text is pretty good and covers some basic rules (such as having an imprint), but it makes the process look much harder than it actually is. I did some as a noob and found setting up an (IT) GmbH and UG in Germany very easy. All the involved people, from the bank to the notary to the tax consultants are usually very helpful and supportive. E.g. setting up the bank account requires a certain flow (because a GmbH is its own legal person), but the notary and the bank will tell you the exact steps (it is like 3 or 4, having the bank and the notary close by makes it easier as you can just walk between the two and get it done on a day :-). The notary will notify all the local authorities that you got founded, you don't need to do anything on your own here.

Though I suppose it is much harder if you don't speak German, or have a friend which does.

I recommend finding a good tax consultant first. Unlike stated in the text they actually are cheap as long as your company doesn't make a lot of money (the fees are usually bound to the earnings). You pay ~70 euros a month, plus ~1000 for the year-end stuff, and they do everything required for you, all the filings, talk to the tax authorities when required, etc. Since they see you as a potential future business (when you make actual money), they will usually help you with all the other things (notary, bank). Some are even registered 'startup helpers'.

Note that you don't have to have a GmbH, you can also just register a 'Gewerbe' (a business) under your own person. That is even easier and much cheaper, but you have full personal liability.

Important: This is specifically for IT companies, which are easy. If you setup other companies, like in the building sector (but almost any other field is affected by this, even a hair cutter!), it can be way harder and usually requires an approved education (you need to be a 'meister' in your field).

The text suggests that you should delay founding the company as long as possible. Be careful with that. If you say produced a significant amount of software before, you technically have to 'sell' that to the company for the fair value (and pay taxes on that etc). It can make things easier if everything is 'owned' by the company from the start. If you talk to investors or want to sell the company, they will want to know about such stuff.

Summary: IMO it is very easy to setup a GmbH/UG - at least if you speak German or have a friend who can translate. Yes, it does cost some money to start and operate (I'd say, calculate ~2500/y), but you'll get limited liability.

P.S.: This again makes the process kinda harder than easier, but most German states actively support startups. There is sponsored consulting for setting up business plans (usually as part of a competition), if you plan to employ people you can get that co-financed, most states even have state-VC's! There are many programs and a lot of public money is put into supporting startups in Germany, but well, you have to deal with authorities :-)

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#18

There is missing ("Gewerbeamt") and partially wrong information there (the 17.500 VAT thing), so use with caution! My best advice: get a tax-guy. They do all this crap and more and while they come with a price (German tax laws are no laughing matters) it's money well spent and also acts as security because said tax-guy shoulders a lot of accountability (pun intended).

You're right, that's the simple and valuable one-sentence advise for anyone starting a business in Germany, and I can only repeat it: get a tax advisor. Trust me, it'll pay for itself.

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#19

Is there a reason to not go BVI/Nevis IBC route for a small online startup ? The no accounting/record-keeping requirement should look appealing to many, beside 0% tax :).

Well, if I Google the name, the first 10 hits look like spam sites set up to promote it.

That's a reason not to go that route, IMHO.

Re: Incorporating a limited company in Germany

#20
post #6

Infinitely easier in the UK: you don't need capital, the forms are simple, it costs virtually nothing and you'll be done in less than a day. https://www.gov.uk/limited-company-formation/register-your-c...

There is/was quite some founding tourism from EU countries with more complicated laws to the UK. I wonder how the Brexit will affect them.

I did that from Italy, wouldn't do it now because of the uncertainty related to brexit. We'll see in the near future.
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