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The woes of Windows 10

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Re: The woes of Windows 10

#191

Post by moosingin3space »

izacus wrote: post #40
akappa wrote: post #20

I think there's an obvious and more general question here to be answered: if a piece of software is good enough, namely, it "disappears" when you are trying to do your job, then why bother to change it? Yes, the new version might enable a more efficient workflow, or might be faster to boot-up. But people hate changes and you need to invest considerable time in upgrading a piece of software (the upgrade itself + learn…

Because developers want to make more money. This is why the app store format is so incredibly popular amongst the developer crowd - it forces people to keep paying you to upgrade app to follow breaking Apple/Google changes just to keep the functionality of the app the same and it appearing for users of new phones. 15 year old software that works well and you buy once does not bring a steady income.

Not a fan of the app store model, but I've literally never heard of people paying for updates on app stores. In fact I've heard many developers complain about the lack of paid upgrades on the Mac App Store.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#192

Post by rocqua »

Arizhel wrote: post #126
corin_ wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your second point doesn't really hold up - I'm a Windows 10 user, and I don't spend any time even considering Linux UI alternatives because you could show me one that I liked twice as much as Windows and I still wouldn't want to use Linux for my day to day stuff. I actually don't mind the Windows 10 UI as it happens, but if there were the variety of options for Windows that there are for Linux, I'd certainly see if I…

If people actually cared about it that much, at the very least there'd be some 3rd-party program available for Windows that would improve the UI, and it'd be selling like hotcakes. I've never heard of any. Same goes for MacOS, iOS, and Android.

I think the windows 10 platform doesn't lend itself very well to 3rd party UIs. It's quite closely coupled to the actual OS.

In a sense though, this is what I consider to be the strength of the windows UI. With the tight coupling, you can make guarantees on the UI covering all possible configuration options. At the same time, it allows a fixed standard of how to implement configuration. (Some of this comes from windows being monolithic)

The end result is a 'unified' UI where there are user-friendly ways to configure a system. Most notably, it is a lot easier to 'explore' the configuration options of windows as opposed to any linux distro.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#193

Post by cowardlydragon »

ZeroClickOk wrote: post #75

I dont know why name Windows 10 a fail, when the bigger competitors of Windows are... Windows! Mac and Linux mostly are used for niche users (as us). I'm really really happy we CAN upgrade for a new Windows version easily, just compare with Android. More: the reason to most people dont upgrade isn't why "Windows 7 is better than Windows 10", but the actual reason is they are comfortable with Win7 and dont want/can ta…

Android and iOS have probably surpassed windows in number of consumer installations.

The PC will be invaded by Android at some point, and it will be like a blitzkreig when it happens. Google would make all their money back shortly off of appstore sales.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#194

Post by shmerl »

tomovo wrote: post #169
shmerl wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It gets a major update every year? Yeah, so where is OpenGL 4.5?

Exactly. It's a shame Apple didn't adopt Vulkan and went with their own proprietary Metal API. Yet another reason for game developers to keep ignoring the platform.

Yeah. A recent example: https://www.gamingonlinux.com/articles/an-interview-with-sim...

> There have been some issues, specifically around certain drivers, issues with Mesa and Intel hardware. I’m hoping all of those are behind us and will remain so. Unlike a lot of other communities, Linux users are quite aware of a lot of the issues with their platform and will usually be OK to wait for an update to fix their issues.

This is opposed to OSX where the updates break things horribly. The support for the OpenGL standard in their drivers has been lacklustre for years and it's only getting worse. They now want developers to move to their proprietary API Metal, but I'm jaded enough not to fall for that. And don't even get me started on having to shell out £3000 for a mid spec dev machine.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#195

Post by wvenable »

mark-r wrote: post #70

Microsoft is their own worst enemy. My wife can't transition fully from XP to the Windows 7 PC I built for her, because it doesn't have Outlook Express or any reasonable substitute. We can't upgrade the living room PC because Windows 10 doesn't include Media Center. I'm also not fond of the way Windows 10 updates are so aggressive, you'll essentially be replacing your OS every so often without any say-so. If I had an…

> I'm also not fond of the way Windows 10 updates are so aggressive, you'll essentially be replacing your OS every so often without any say-so.

If you have the pro version, you can control this. I don't even have regular updates install automatically.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#196

Post by shmerl »

ihattendorf wrote: post #187
shmerl wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> don't see Linux's market share growing by large numbers. https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qpcustom=... > Apple updates macOS every year. I hear complaints from MacOS users about the bit rot all the time. Where is OpenGL 4.5 for instance? And not just graphics. Many simply feel it's completely stagnated, because Apple are too busy with their mobile delirium, and don't care about desktop anymore.

> large numbers

Absolute numbers are large. I'm more interested in the trend here. Still, there should be more push for Linux on the desktop. This sick situation exited for way too long.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#197

Post by Pica_soO »

eumoria wrote: post #156
Unbeliever69 wrote: post #57

I am a manager at a small architecture firm and Windows 10 has brought nothing but woe to my office. We have spent dozens of hours and thousands of dollars troubleshooting and fixing problems (many of which remain unresolved) that occurred as a result of this draconian forced upgrade (and updates that followed). So what if we got the upgrade for free. I've paid for it many times over in labor!

Every time I hear about updates being "forced," yes, Microsoft did some shady things to trick non-tech people into the upgrade which I agree is shady. However any competent IT manager would know how to stop that from happening. Even a cursory google search shows you how to remove the windows update that starts the upgrade. Also all computers on a network domain will not auto update. Each time I read of an IT manager…

Black UI magic, to shove users into a certain direction, that needs to be yanked from the registry and forbidden via group policies- and that can be defended?

You know a OS is in a bad spot, if it gathers followers, who attack criticizing experience reports and anecdotes. Who needs truth if one has beauty?

Windows job was to provide a easy, trap-free OS, one where you wouldn't spend weeks with a bomb-defusal kit, looking at the upgrades blowing up systems.

Well at least the victims of the landmine dont have to worry about shipjumping converts of the holy church of the foreboding fruit snapping at them for heresy.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#198

Post by wvenable »

mark-r wrote: post #107
ZeroClickOk wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Media Center? Why dont you use Kodi (former XBMC)?

Because it already came with Windows and was exactly what we needed. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. If the PC dies someday and needs to be replaced, I might look into avoiding Windows altogether.

Media center was pretty good when it was released but it's kind of "meh" these days. I understand "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." but sometimes it's actually nice to have something new.

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#199

Post by fnordsensei »

mark-r wrote: post #70

Microsoft is their own worst enemy. My wife can't transition fully from XP to the Windows 7 PC I built for her, because it doesn't have Outlook Express or any reasonable substitute. We can't upgrade the living room PC because Windows 10 doesn't include Media Center. I'm also not fond of the way Windows 10 updates are so aggressive, you'll essentially be replacing your OS every so often without any say-so. If I had an…

It's a paid option, but I've found Postbox to be the least annoying those rare instances when I need to check my email on my gaming PC. https://www.postbox-inc.com

Re: The woes of Windows 10

#200

Post by 794CD01 »

mnm1 wrote: post #80
akappa wrote: post #20

I think there's an obvious and more general question here to be answered: if a piece of software is good enough, namely, it "disappears" when you are trying to do your job, then why bother to change it? Yes, the new version might enable a more efficient workflow, or might be faster to boot-up. But people hate changes and you need to invest considerable time in upgrading a piece of software (the upgrade itself + learn…

Profit. How else is Microsoft (or any other company) going to make money off software no one needs or wants? Other than rehashing the same old product and pushing it onto users for more money, more surveillance, or both, they have nothing of value to sell on the software side. Even if they did have something of value to sell, over 90% of the people have already bought their product. Gotta keep the cash rolling in so…

Obvious answer: switch to a subscription-based model. They are already doing it with Office.
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