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Computer Science Education

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Re: Computer Science Education

#91

Post by wolfgke »

GrantSolar wrote: post #32
dotancohen wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see why this rather insightful post is downvoted. The site specifically targets these groups by name. Why in the age of a _World_ Wide Web and "post-discrimination" are large companies such as Google deliberately targeting specific groups? What will be in the girls-only code program that might be inappropriate for boys?

>Why in the age of a _World_ Wide Web and "post-discrimination" are large companies such as Google deliberately targeting specific groups? Because the gender ratio in STEM fields skews heavily towards men. >What will be in the girls-only code program that might be inappropriate for boys? I can't imagine there would be anything that was 'inappropriate', though there may be some boys less excited about making a dress l…

> Because the gender ratio in STEM fields skews heavily towards men.

Girls are free to study what they want. If they don't want to study STEM fields - their problem, which I don't feel having to care for.

Re: Computer Science Education

#92

Post by paulddraper »

pliptvo wrote: post #73
m0nty wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks great if you're Indian, Irish or female. Edit: Or AU/NZ, missed that one.

Problem: There's a massive gender imbalance in CS and amongst the coding community. There are loads of men and hardly any women. Most of half the population would never consider working for us or our partners. Solution: Make a website which specifically encourages young girls to see themselves as coders. Problem: We have invested loads of money into our Irish, Indian, Australian/NZ offices, but we could increase our…

> What is the problem?

Discrimination.

It has been justified for centuries with all manner of reasoned arguments. Hopefully we will eventually learn discrimination is a Bad Idea.

Re: Computer Science Education

#93

Post by wolfgke »

YCode wrote: post #60
notgood wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know why we create software? To automate things, stuff that before required lot of accountants can be now down with software + one accountant. So we made accounting "cheaper" cutting a lot of jobs; should we stop making software because it makes labor cheaper? should we stop making robots because it makes labor cheaper? Fuck that; if socio-economics has a problem we need to find a solution that doesn't involve st…

I got into a discussion about this recently. It seems like most of the time new technology and automation inherently creates less jobs than it depreciates. Meanwhile, the population only goes up. Assuming those two statements are true in a given economy, then this is going to become a major problem for society as the number of people drastically outmatches the number of (skilled?) jobs that need performed. At a certa…

> I got into a discussion about this recently. It seems like most of the time new technology and automation inherently creates less jobs than it depreciates.

> Meanwhile, the population only goes up.

That's why one should consider people who produce children as "evil-minded". There are few things that are similar as cruel as producing children who will have no place in society. Antinatalism for the win.

Re: Computer Science Education

#94

Post by wolfgke »

matt4077 wrote: post #31
Mayzie wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The issue was that people with disabilities across the country (i.e. non-Berkeley-students) were suing Berkeley for not making their videos disabled-friendly. What the f#$k? Suing because their videos are not "disabled-friendly"? What does that even mean? God, the lawsuit trigger-happiness of some people...

> "disabled-friendly"? What does that even mean? I'd say lawsuits such these would be far fewer if people were at least aware of the existence of disabled people, and spend a modicum of attention on how to enable their participation in society. "video" being latin for "to see" may provide a clue as to the type of disability that could have trouble accessing this content. I'm not familiar enough with the subtleties of…

> I'd say lawsuits such these would be far fewer if people were at least aware of the existence of disabled people, and spend a modicum of attention on how to enable their participation in society.

I'd say people would be much more tolerant towards people with disabilities if there weren't such crazy laws and lawsuits.

Re: Computer Science Education

#95

Post by wolfgke »

paulddraper wrote: post #92
pliptvo wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem: There's a massive gender imbalance in CS and amongst the coding community. There are loads of men and hardly any women. Most of half the population would never consider working for us or our partners. Solution: Make a website which specifically encourages young girls to see themselves as coders. Problem: We have invested loads of money into our Irish, Indian, Australian/NZ offices, but we could increase our…

> What is the problem? Discrimination. It has been justified for centuries with all manner of reasoned arguments. Hopefully we will eventually learn discrimination is a Bad Idea.

> Hopefully we will eventually learn discrimination is a Bad Idea.

... including discrimination against boys/men - which quota regulation and "women only" programs are (imagine the outcry if one would replace "women only" by "white people only").

Re: Computer Science Education

#96

Post by mej10 »

wolfgke wrote: post #93
YCode wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got into a discussion about this recently. It seems like most of the time new technology and automation inherently creates less jobs than it depreciates. Meanwhile, the population only goes up. Assuming those two statements are true in a given economy, then this is going to become a major problem for society as the number of people drastically outmatches the number of (skilled?) jobs that need performed. At a certa…

> I got into a discussion about this recently. It seems like most of the time new technology and automation inherently creates less jobs than it depreciates. > Meanwhile, the population only goes up. That's why one should consider people who produce children as "evil-minded". There are few things that are similar as cruel as producing children who will have no place in society. Antinatalism for the win.

Without children the human species will simply die. If that's your goal or an accepted side-effect of your goal, then Antinatalism makes sense.

If you don't want humanity to die, then it is far too simplistic and it would actually be wrong to not value people having children -- at least to some degree -- since as far as we know it is the only way for humanity to continue.

In reality, as with most things, there is a lot of grey area and difference of circumstance that factor into the morality of such a decision.

Re: Computer Science Education

#97

Post by YCode »

wolfgke wrote: post #93
YCode wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got into a discussion about this recently. It seems like most of the time new technology and automation inherently creates less jobs than it depreciates. Meanwhile, the population only goes up. Assuming those two statements are true in a given economy, then this is going to become a major problem for society as the number of people drastically outmatches the number of (skilled?) jobs that need performed. At a certa…

> I got into a discussion about this recently. It seems like most of the time new technology and automation inherently creates less jobs than it depreciates. > Meanwhile, the population only goes up. That's why one should consider people who produce children as "evil-minded". There are few things that are similar as cruel as producing children who will have no place in society. Antinatalism for the win.

Sort of.

On the other hand, on a national or global scale having children is not optional.

If you want your species to continue, some people have to have children.

That said, I agree in that I believe contraception should be essentially free to anyone who wants it. There's simply no logical reason for society to bring unwanted and superfluous children into the world.

Re: Computer Science Education

#98

Post by camus2 »

paulddraper wrote: post #92
pliptvo wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem: There's a massive gender imbalance in CS and amongst the coding community. There are loads of men and hardly any women. Most of half the population would never consider working for us or our partners. Solution: Make a website which specifically encourages young girls to see themselves as coders. Problem: We have invested loads of money into our Irish, Indian, Australian/NZ offices, but we could increase our…

> What is the problem? Discrimination. It has been justified for centuries with all manner of reasoned arguments. Hopefully we will eventually learn discrimination is a Bad Idea.

> Discrimination.

So it's a problem in CS but not in education or healthcare, where women are the majority?

Re: Computer Science Education

#99

Post by wolfgke »

YCode wrote: post #97
wolfgke wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I got into a discussion about this recently. It seems like most of the time new technology and automation inherently creates less jobs than it depreciates. > Meanwhile, the population only goes up. That's why one should consider people who produce children as "evil-minded". There are few things that are similar as cruel as producing children who will have no place in society. Antinatalism for the win.

Sort of. On the other hand, on a national or global scale having children is not optional. If you want your species to continue, some people have to have children. That said, I agree in that I believe contraception should be essentially free to anyone who wants it. There's simply no logical reason for society to bring unwanted and superfluous children into the world.

> If you want your species to continue, some people have to have children.

But only as many as society really needs (currently we have to many) and and only if there exist people that are willing to bail if the child will be unemployed (a risk that will increase with even more automatization).

Re: Computer Science Education

#100

Post by pliptvo »

reitanqild wrote: post #85
pliptvo wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem: There's a massive gender imbalance in CS and amongst the coding community. There are loads of men and hardly any women. Most of half the population would never consider working for us or our partners. Solution: Make a website which specifically encourages young girls to see themselves as coders. Problem: We have invested loads of money into our Irish, Indian, Australian/NZ offices, but we could increase our…

No problem for you. And I have learned to live with it but as a young boy it was extremely frustrating to see girls getting advantages throughout the whole school system just for being girls. Now I am fully aware that I have certain advantages ("privileges") as well but as I said: when you are young this can be extremely frustrating.

I can't speak for your particular experience at school, but in general I think it's a shame that people whose lives are, as you say, "privileged" by the systems in which we live feel like they are at a disadvantage because of concerted attempts to raise others to their level.
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