The JVM is not that heavy

#1

Post by khy » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 6:08 PM UTC

The JVM is not that heavy
opensourcery.co.za

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#2

Post by my123 » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:01 PM UTC

Note that you can also use IKVM and then Mono AOT if you don't want a JIT at all.

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#3

Post by relics443 » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:08 PM UTC

I've been using these arguments at my company for years. There's definitely FUD surrounding the JVM, and it's pretty ridiculous. Sure, it's not a perfect system, but it's usually disregarded for being "old and bloated".

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#4

Post by vvanders » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:08 PM UTC

Start-up times are still an issue with Clojure on the JVM. For instance with Android I've found the initialization times to be pretty much a show-stopper for any application development.

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#5

Post by bpicolo » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:09 PM UTC

vvanders wrote: post #4

Start-up times are still an issue with Clojure on the JVM. For instance with Android I've found the initialization times to be pretty much a show-stopper for any application development.

That's a lot different a context than web-application deployment, though.

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#6

Post by david-given » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:09 PM UTC

Way back when I ran a comment engine that was a custom Java servlet running on an embedded (i.e. mostly interpreted) JVM on a NSLU2: a 266MHz ARM with 32MB RAM. The servlet container was Winstone. Can't remember what the JVM was, sorry.

Load wasn't exactly high, but it worked absolutely fine.

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#7

Post by sandGorgon » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:12 PM UTC

I used to think this too, until I came across http://www.scylladb.com/

It is a fork of cassandra written in the Seastar c++ framework and is drop-in compatible with cassandra. Claims 10x increase in performance.

I always thought there was a few percentage points difference - never a 10x performance difference between java and c++. And that too for a project with as many man hours and facebook-scale tuning as cassandra.

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#8

Post by agumonkey » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:12 PM UTC

vvanders wrote: post #4

Start-up times are still an issue with Clojure on the JVM. For instance with Android I've found the initialization times to be pretty much a show-stopper for any application development.

That's mostly on clojure.core being so large and rebuilt each time by default isn't it ?

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#9

Post by relics443 » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:12 PM UTC

vvanders wrote: post #4

Start-up times are still an issue with Clojure on the JVM. For instance with Android I've found the initialization times to be pretty much a show-stopper for any application development.

Android doesn't run the JVM.

Re: The JVM is not that heavy

#10

Post by lnanek2 » Wed, Feb 01, 2017, 7:15 PM UTC

vvanders wrote: post #4

Start-up times are still an issue with Clojure on the JVM. For instance with Android I've found the initialization times to be pretty much a show-stopper for any application development.

I don't know anything about Clojure, but in modern Android development, Instant Run patch files mean installation isn't even done each change any more. Even then, you can avoid a lot of installation time by using an emulator on a fast development machine instead of a real device. For most of Android's life the emulator has been disgustingly slow, but for installation times, it has benefits. Meanwhile restoring from a snapshot instead of booting fresh each time, x86 emulator images, and Intel's virtualization engine mean the speed isn't so bad any more.