Welcome, ACLU • Hacker News Board

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#541

Post by TheCoelacanth » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:39 PM UTC

jessriedel wrote: post #362

alpha_squared wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the ACLU non-partisan?

Nominally, but so are other organizations that are clearly partisan in practice. I don't think anyone disputes that members of the ACLU are overwhelmingly democrats. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_Liberties_Union... It's hard to imagine this doesn't have real-world consequences, e.g., strategically choosing to not defend right-leaning speech as vigorously as left-leaning speech.

They defend actual Nazis. That's about as right-leaning as you can possibly get.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#542

Post by Eridrus » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:40 PM UTC

mattnewton wrote: post #488

coldpie wrote: post #344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Time for conservatives to sack up, speak out, and vote their conscious, then. They've been extremely quiet so far.

They are; the party loyals use softer language (like John McCain), but there are plenty who owe trump nothing and are a bit louder (like the Koch Brothers)

We'll see how much the Koch brothers care in the mid-terms; if they're not pressuring senators and congressmen to oppose trump at the risk of primary challenges, we'll see that either their loudness is only about his tone, or that they are powerless to fight Trump's base.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#543

Post by savagej » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:41 PM UTC

eddieroger wrote: post #182

savagej wrote: post #8

I thought the "A" in ACLU stood for American.

It does. What do you mean by your comment?

People who have never been to America are not Americans.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#544

Post by Eridrus » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:42 PM UTC

ajamesm wrote: post #274

ErikVandeWater wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes this is somewhat dangerous for YC. I would like to see that this was planned before November and their support was not determined by who the president turned out to be. Combined with the outspoken politics of Paul Graham1, I get the feeling people who identify as conservatives may not feel welcome at YC. 1 http://twitter.com/paulg EDIT: I changed "conservatives" to "people who identify as conservatives" to clarif…

The ACLU, in the past week, received as much $ in online donation as it has over the past six years. Cash talks and bullshit walks. Tell me, if you're a free-market conservative, why YC or the ACLU should disregard such a resonating and clear message from the market.

> The ACLU, in the past week, received as much $ in online donation as it has over the past six years.

That's pretty depressing.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#545

Post by deeth_starr » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:43 PM UTC

muninn_ wrote: post #41

Although I think the American Civil Liberties Union is incredibly valuable and I'm glad they have a lot more money now to fight for the American people, I'm questioning all of this. Where was the outpouring of funding when black people were being gunned down by cops from West Coast organizations? Where has YCombinator been as our own impoverished African-Americans are getting slaughtered in the streets of Chicago? Wh…

Black people didn't turn out to support Hillary against the Trump racism against Mexicans and Middle-East countries. Now you complain?

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#546

Post by anigbrowl » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:44 PM UTC

ihsw wrote: post #75

joshmarlow wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this makes sense strategically for multiple reasons: - YC would undoubtedly like to ensure there are no barriers to immigrant founded startups that they would like to invest in - ensuring that there are fewer barriers to employment by immigrants in invested startups - generally trying to build a better more open world (which is in line with the UBI initiative [0] as well as the stated interest in investigatin…

Except diversity-based hiring is no more than farcical politicking, building a better and more open world is an empty slogan, and barriers to employing immigrants are important to prevent the same violent demographic change we have seen in Europe.

building a better and more open world is an empty slogan

You don't speak for me. I favor a world without closed borders where labor can move as freely as capital does and transactional and jurisdictional burdens are coordinated so as to be minimal. I'm very impressed by the EU's Schengen agreement permitting free movement between all EU states, and I doubt any Americans would favor interstate border restrictions despite the sometimes huge differences between individual states.

You're welcome to hold a different opinion, but that's all it is.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#547

Post by rfrank » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:44 PM UTC

CydeWeys wrote: post #341

muninn_ wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other problems still exist and in my opinion are far worse. My argument is that we should prioritize problems like those over the current outcry.

A lot of people believe that we are in the midst of a fascist takeover of the United States government. The most terrifying part is that this can't simply be dismissed as a conspiracy theory, given the actions that have taken place so far. I don't see how "the current outcry" can possibly be dismissed in this context, or how anything else could be more important.

> The most terrifying part is that this can't simply be dismissed as a conspiracy theory, given the actions that have taken place so far.

Yes it can, and an awful lot of people are doing just that.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#548

Post by CPLX » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:44 PM UTC

Pigo wrote: post #525

joshfraser wrote: post #427

I've been a long time supporter of the ACLU. While they're being politicized right now as being anti-Trump, the thing I admire most about them is their consistency in fighting for the rights of everyone. They stick to their principles of free speech and human equality no matter how unpopular the issue or unsavory their client. A good example is back in the 1930s when the ACLU simultaneously defended the rights of bla…

I would really like to see if a moral position like that could still stand tall. I'd be surprised if they could defend Milo Yiannopoulos's Twitter account without massive protests and everyone losing their job.

There are literally zero constitutional issues raised by the nature of his relationship with Twitter.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#549

Post by jckt » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:44 PM UTC

monochromatic wrote: post #270

equalarrow wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are your rights 'trendy'? I tend to stay out of politics, and don't really label people as such, but Trump is a bad guy. I'm happy to donate engineering time to the ACLU.

> Trump is a bad guy That's your political opinion. Half the country disagrees (or at least found him less-bad than the alternative).

Doesn't make him not a bad guy.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#550

Post by wfunction » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 6:45 PM UTC

muninn_ wrote: post #41

Although I think the American Civil Liberties Union is incredibly valuable and I'm glad they have a lot more money now to fight for the American people, I'm questioning all of this. Where was the outpouring of funding when black people were being gunned down by cops from West Coast organizations? Where has YCombinator been as our own impoverished African-Americans are getting slaughtered in the streets of Chicago? Wh…

One difference between current events and previous ones is that the current problems run all the way up to the president and Congress, whereas the previous ones did not. I suspect if Obama was the one ordering blacks to be gunned down and Congress was behind him the situation would've changed dramatically.