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Welcome, ACLU

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Re: Welcome, ACLU

#281

Post by cabalamat »

tghw wrote: post #205
matt_wulfeck wrote: post #166

I used to be an ACLU supporter, but stopped after their main objectives switched to more of what I describe as matters of feelings , E.g., whether a man who identifies as a women can use a women's bathroom in Georgia, or whether the term man or women can ever be used at all. In my opinion most the ACLU LGBT agenda has been a useless war on words , yet it's taking on a greater and greater importance in the organizatio…

That's hardly their main focus. Go to https://www.aclu.org/ and click Issues. LGBT Rights are just one of 18 top level issues (many broken down into many more related issues). I love the EFF, but they don't cover voting rights, disability rights, immigration rights, racial justice, etc.

> racial justice

According to https://www.aclu.org/issues/racial-justice/affirmative-actio... they support discrimination against white people:

> Affirmative action is one of the most effective tools for redressing the injustices caused by our nation’s historic discrimination against people of color and women, and for leveling what has long been an uneven playing field.

This is bad for two reasons

1. is is immoral in principle

2. it is bad politics; attitudes like this make it more likely that Trump will win a 2nd term

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#282

Post by rqebmm »

beaconstudios wrote: post #253
rattray wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Conservatives of a libertarian bent are likely to feel quite welcome, and AFAICT have always been well-represented.

I'm not sure that's so true any more. See: calls to sever ties with Peter Thiel on every political thread on HN right now.

Well that's because he's publicly backed Trump, who is as un-libertarian as you can get.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#283

Post by chimeracoder »

sp332 wrote: post #215
justin66 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fairness, they are an advocacy group whose activities include political lobbying. No idea how accurate these figures are, but: https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/clientsum.php?id=D00003147...

This confuses me, but "only donations to the 501(c)(3) foundation are tax deductible, and only the 501(c)(4) group can engage in unlimited political lobbying. The two organizations share office space and employees." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_Liberties_Union

An organization can be simultaneously a 501(c)3 and a 501(c)4 - often this is managed by having two separate legal entities with a mutual relationship, but it's possible for the same organization to be classified both ways.

Separately, a 501(c)3 is allowed to engage in lobbying - they are just subject to restrictions on how much time and money than can spend (last I checked, it's up to 10% of time and 10% of money).

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#284

Post by pdkl95 »

muninn_ wrote: post #41

Although I think the American Civil Liberties Union is incredibly valuable and I'm glad they have a lot more money now to fight for the American people, I'm questioning all of this. Where was the outpouring of funding when black people were being gunned down by cops from West Coast organizations? Where has YCombinator been as our own impoverished African-Americans are getting slaughtered in the streets of Chicago? Wh…

> Where was [...]

In politics, I believe it's important to use the philosophy of "better late than never". Memes take time to diffuse into the population. It is better to encourage more participation in the future by accepting late arrivals. Attacking people that finally decided to participate can easily drive them away.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#285

Post by brandall10 »

muninn_ wrote: post #41

Although I think the American Civil Liberties Union is incredibly valuable and I'm glad they have a lot more money now to fight for the American people, I'm questioning all of this. Where was the outpouring of funding when black people were being gunned down by cops from West Coast organizations? Where has YCombinator been as our own impoverished African-Americans are getting slaughtered in the streets of Chicago? Wh…

I think the major difference is this a new, chilling shift of civil liberties enacted by a political administration - whereas the issues surrounding race/homelessness in this country are pre-existing are having an increasing light shown on them.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#286

Post by zitterbewegung »

The article is short of details and I am curious what ycombinator will contribute to the ACLU other than capital (networking? , constructive criticism ) ? It doesn't fit the previous nonprofits since it is well established.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#287

Post by whorleater »

jlgaddis wrote: post #259
gthtjtkt wrote: post #181

So when we were dropping bombs on them it wasn't worth making an official statement, but now that they get held up at the border for a few hours it's suddenly worth talking about? I can't think of a case where the term "Virtue Signaling" is more apt.

Did a bunch of people just learn the term "virtue signaling" in the last few days? I don't recall seeing it spoken on here in ages but it seems I've read it 20 times in just the last few days. It reminds me of a child who learns a new, big word and then porceeds to use it in conversation (to "show off") as often as possible.

It's a newer form of calling people "SJW's" or "White Knights", thereby reducing their opposition to caricatures and removing any realistic and reasonable discussion.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#288

Post by egocodedinsol »

muninn_ wrote: post #41

Although I think the American Civil Liberties Union is incredibly valuable and I'm glad they have a lot more money now to fight for the American people, I'm questioning all of this. Where was the outpouring of funding when black people were being gunned down by cops from West Coast organizations? Where has YCombinator been as our own impoverished African-Americans are getting slaughtered in the streets of Chicago? Wh…

When you've convinced people to come to your side and donate money to it, demanding an apology for not coming sooner is a great strategy for revenge, but not a great one for your cause.

From an activist friend:

"Hearing leftists be like "ugh these protesters are so passionate about protesting now but I didn't see them protesting at BLM marches three years ago!" is one of those things that makes me wonder whether the left has been infiltrated by the CIA or whether the death-wish is native."

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#289

Post by tptacek »

muninn_ wrote: post #41

Although I think the American Civil Liberties Union is incredibly valuable and I'm glad they have a lot more money now to fight for the American people, I'm questioning all of this. Where was the outpouring of funding when black people were being gunned down by cops from West Coast organizations? Where has YCombinator been as our own impoverished African-Americans are getting slaughtered in the streets of Chicago? Wh…

This is an entirely legitimate concern.

We're not meant to sit here stroking our chins and purring about the good deeds of our favorite companies. YC has an incredible position in Silicon Valley, built over a decade with the help and influence of people like us.

To whom much is given, much is required. I'm glad YC is helping ACLU out this winter. But ACLU took in more money in 1 day last week than NILC, the National Immigration Law Center, spends in a year. After they get done patting themselves on the back for the ACLU win, they should start figuring out how to help the smaller organizations that don't have ACLU's built-in advantages.

We're not here to feel sympathy for Y Combinator or Sam Altman. Most of us will never meet any of these people and, candidly, can't fathom the amount of financial success and security their position has brought them. More power to them! But they exist to us as abstractions, and rightly so, and any pressure we can bring to bear to more fully enlist them in the cause of shoring up our institutions and the rule of law is legitimate.

Push harder. Thanks for that comment.

Re: Welcome, ACLU

#290

Post by aptwebapps »

ihsw wrote: post #50
chickenfries wrote: post #16

Peter Thiel insists that the immigration EO is does not constitute a religious ban [1], but Rudy Giuliani says this is exactly what the President asked for [2] (Also, we heard him say as much many, many times). [1] http://www.forbes.com/sites/ryanmac/2017/01/28/peter-thiel-s... [2] http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/316726-giuliani-t...

It's not just Peter Thiel but anyone of sound mind -- the top 5 countries by Muslim-majority population are not included. * Indonesia 204,847,000 (87.2%) * Pakistan 178,097,000 (96.4%) * India 172,245,158 (14.2%) * Bangladesh 145,312,000 (90%) * Nigeria 75,728,000 (47.9%) If Indonesia suddenly became plagued by radical Islamic terrorism then it would be on the list too. The seven countries targeted by the immigration…

An incomplete Muslim ban is still a Muslim ban. He's not banning any other religions as far as I know.
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